Hello. I'm pleased to find this forum.

[welshmike]

I'm a fairly keen road biker and my wife has just bought a Gazelle Orange CX HM so that she can thrash me getting up hills ;-)
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.0115983,-1.2639006,3a,75y,79.39h,61.2t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s5WWUegcwn2MXL4FESvzv8w!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1
She runs the bike in manual assist mode and has a problem getting started on steep hills.
When she starts pedalling with one foot as she starts to mount the bike there is not enough electric assist to give forward motion or time to get her other foot on the other pedal as she mounts the bike.
I have tried the same and did not find it possible to get going.
Yesterday on a small hill outside my house I set the bike in cadence mode and by giving the twist grip maximum power I could get going successfully.
It remains to be seen if cadence mode is the most suitable way to get started on a steep hill.
What does the team advise please?

 

[trex]

she may find a Chinese bike with a full throttle much easier to ride up Welsh hills.

 

[welshmike]

she may find a Chinese bike with a full throttle much easier to ride up Welsh hills.

Please could you give me an example of such a bike?
(I understand that to ride an e-bike that is not a pedelec one has to have a riding licence and pay road tax?)

 

[LeighPing]

Please could you give me an example of such a bike?
(I understand that to ride an e-bike that is not a pedelec one has to have a riding licence and pay road tax?)

Don't get too paranoid Mike. No-one's going to eat your lunch for having a thumb throttle.

Have you tried popping it into a lower gear, before pulling away up those hills?

 

[welshmike]

Don't get too paranoid Mike. No-one's going to eat your lunch for having a thumb throttle.

Have you tried popping it into a lower gear, before pulling away up those hills?

Sorry but your reply is not relevant to the difficulties my wife has had starting her pedelec e-bike on a steep hill (this bike and please read up how its Harmony system works http://electricbikesguildford.com/electric_bikes/gazelle_orange_cx_hybrid_m_2016_step_through.html ) .

 

[LeighPing]

Sorry but your reply is not relevant to the difficulties my wife has had starting her pedelec e-bike on a steep hill (this bike and please read up how its Harmony system works http://electricbikesguildford.com/electric_bikes/gazelle_orange_cx_hybrid_m_2016_step_through.html ) .

I thought that dropping it into a lower gear to start off on a hill was relevant myself. Thanks for the link. You live and learn eh.

"The highlight of the bike though is undoubtedly the Nuvinci Harmoy gears. The Nuvinci system means that instead of step changes between the gears you have a seamless transmission, giving, in effect, an infinite number of gear ratios."

It sounds great. But it's obviously not.

Hill climbing ebikes. Click to view.

 

[welshmike]

I thought that dropping it into a lower gear to start off on a hill was relevant myself. Thanks for the link. You live and learn eh.

"The highlight of the bike though is undoubtedly the Nuvinci Harmoy gears. The Nuvinci system means that instead of step changes between the gears you have a seamless transmission, giving, in effect, an infinite number of gear ratios."

It sounds great. But it's obviously not.

Hill climbing ebikes. Click to view.

Yes indeed the Harmony of the Bosch motor and the Nuvinci CVT provides seamless gear changing.
My wife, who has physical problems preventing her riding a non e-bike, has ridden her new Gazelle e-bike just once over a 30 mile ride last Thursday.
(I was riding my Specialized Sirrus hybrid to accompany her and she left me standing on the hills).
She set the Harmony system in Manual mode where she used the twist grip to vary the gearing. This mode is the same as she used for a rental e-bike in Majorca recently and enjoyed the rides there.
As I wrote before I tried the bike with the system set in Automatic mode with cadence set near maximum cadence of 90 and I could get going successfully on a small hill.
So next time my wife rides the bike I ask her to use Automatic mode and will report back here.

 

[welshmike]

Well I promised to reports back.

My wife has now enjoyed her third country lanes ride on her new bicycle which carried her up a couple of steep hills at between 10 and 15 mph while I struggled in the lowest gear of my sports road bike at 4 mph (I need the exercise).

This time she set the Harmony system in Automatic mode. That made it a little easier to start riding on the flat.

I do understand that the pedals have to be moving for electrical assist to be provided from the Bosch motor and my wife's bicycle works correctly as specified.

For now there appear to be two options to overcome starting ascending a hill having stopped on the hill.

1. I give my wife's bicycle a push to assist her to start on a hill.
2. She rides back down the hill and starts cycling on a flat section before the hill.

Any other suggestions please?

 

[Deleted member 4366]

No magic wand will change the way that bike works and you've tried just about everything. You've bought it now, so I guess you don't want to change it, but being blunt, it's the wrong bike for her.

Although it's not legal to sell bikes with throttles, fitting a throttle doesn't make the bike illegal (in the UK), so the various retailers have various creative ways you can get a throttle on their bikes. Some bikes have throttles for walk-assist (6km/h), which are also legal. They at least get you started; however, there's normally an unlock code somewhere which allows you to change its mode to normal operation.

I've just been to fix a woman's 2008 Ezee bike. Sitting in her garage was a brand new Bosch powered bike like your wife's. She bought it when the battery went in her Ezee bike, but she also lives on a steep hill and admitted that she can't get started and that it takes too much effort to pedal up her steep hills, so the Bosch bike has sat unused in her garage. Instead, she's bought a replacement battery for the Ezee bike, which has a throttle.

Bikes I can recommend that don't have the problem your wife is experiencing are: Woosh Big Bear LS, The Oxygen S-Cross ST or the E-mate step-through, Wisper 705 Torque, Ezee bikes and probably Juicy Bikes. There'll be a lot more, but these are the ones that I know.

 

[Artstu]

1. I give my wife's bicycle a push to assist her to start on a hill.
2. She rides back down the hill and starts cycling on a flat section before the hill.

Any other suggestions please?

Don't stop on a hill.

 

[Wisper Bikes]

No magic wand will change the way that bike works and you've tried just about everything. You've bought it now, so I guess you don't want to change it, but being blunt, it's the wrong bike for her.

Although it's not legal to sell bikes with throttles, fitting a throttle doesn't make the bike illegal (in the UK), so the various retailers have various creative ways you can get a throttle on their bikes. Some bikes have throttles for walk-assist (6km/h), which are also legal. They at least get you started; however, there's normally an unlock code somewhere which allows you to change its mode to normal operation.

I've just been to fix a woman's 2008 Ezee bike. Sitting in her garage was a brand new Bosch powered bike like your wife's. She bought it when the battery went in her Ezee bike, but she also lives on a steep hill and admitted that she can't get started and that it takes too much effort to pedal up her steep hills, so the Bosch bike has sat unused in her garage. Instead, she's bought a replacement battery for the Ezee bike, which has a throttle.

Bikes I can recommend that don't have the problem your wife is experiencing are: Woosh Big Bear LS, The Oxygen S-Cross ST or the E-mate step-through, Wisper 705 Torque, Ezee bikes and probably Juicy Bikes. There'll be a lot more, but these are the ones that I know.

It's good to have you back Dave, straight talking sense! We sell both Bosch and our own torque sensor hub bikes with throttle. I know which I would rather do a hill start on! I also know which one I use to commute on.

Bosch of course is fantastic especially for the fitter amongst us and for the off road lads, but not so good for a huge number of people, people like the OP's wife.

My advice... dont be blinded by the big names, you can often buy better bikes with better drive systems from smaller companies, and save some cash.

To sum up, try before you buy and if you want a bike that starts well on a steep hill, then try the bikes on a steep hill start.

All the best, David

 

[welshmike]

No magic wand will change the way that bike works and you've tried just about everything. You've bought it now, so I guess you don't want to change it, but being blunt, it's the wrong bike for her.

Although it's not legal to sell bikes with throttles, fitting a throttle doesn't make the bike illegal (in the UK), so the various retailers have various creative ways you can get a throttle on their bikes. Some bikes have throttles for walk-assist (6km/h), which are also legal. They at least get you started; however, there's normally an unlock code somewhere which allows you to change its mode to normal operation.

I've just been to fix a woman's 2008 Ezee bike. Sitting in her garage was a brand new Bosch powered bike like your wife's. She bought it when the battery went in her Ezee bike, but she also lives on a steep hill and admitted that she can't get started and that it takes too much effort to pedal up her steep hills, so the Bosch bike has sat unused in her garage. Instead, she's bought a replacement battery for the Ezee bike, which has a throttle.

Bikes I can recommend that don't have the problem your wife is experiencing are: Woosh Big Bear LS, The Oxygen S-Cross ST or the E-mate step-through, Wisper 705 Torque, Ezee bikes and probably Juicy Bikes. There'll be a lot more, but these are the ones that I know.

Yes indeed the lack of a Harmony function that would make it easy to start riding the bike on a hill was a serious oversight on my part having been seduced with the otherwise superb system.

If I fully understand how the Harmony system and sensors work there may be a way of changing the hardware/software to make it easier/possible to start riding the bike on a hill.

I'm sorry to read about the woman's experience with her new bike.

I now believe that my wife's bike was designed to be used in Holland on flat terrain and by women who use such bikes as a way of life, shopping, commuting, etc. wearing normal day clothes including long skirts and overcoats without having to wear Lycra.

Thanks for the list of bikes that don't have the hill starting problem. I will look them up and decide what to do next such as selling or part exchanging my wife's bike for a suitable one.

 

[welshmike]

It's good to have you back Dave, straight talking sense! We sell both Bosch and our own torque sensor hub bikes with throttle. I know which I would rather do a hill start on! I also know which one I use to commute on.

Bosch of course is fantastic especially for the fitter amongst us and for the off road lads, but not so good for a huge number of people, people like the OP's wife.

My advice... dont be blinded by the big names, you can often buy better bikes with better drive systems from smaller companies, and save some cash.

To sum up, try before you buy and if you want a bike that starts well on a steep hill, then try the bikes on a steep hill start.

All the best, David

My wife rode a similar bike with an earlier Harmony system that she hired over 2 weeks in Mallorca and was delighted with it.
There was no occasion when she had to stop on a hill and restart in Mallorca unlike her first ride here in Hampshire when an oncoming vehicle in a narrow hilly lane forced her to stop.
My wife has enjoyed two further rides here, the longest being 37 miles and no occasion arose where she had to stop on a hill.
So as well as investigating and trying electric bikes that make it easy to start on a hill we'll see how my wife gets on with further rides on her current bike over the next few months.