Guest Bike Conversion

The plan is to convert my old hybrid for when my daughter comes to stay ( and anyone else who fancies a ride out with us). Although she's only 29 and a professional dancer, poor thing can't keep up with her old mom and dad. Cruel really tee hee:D So need to keep it simple and easy to ride for people not used to assist.

 

I intend to upgrade the front brake. Stick a rear wheel hub on and use an Ezee battery and rack (if John will sell me one). That way I can alternate the battery with my own to keep it active. I will also need to replace the gear changers as the current ones are intergrated with the brake levers.

 

Anyway, this is the bike, used have my Ezee kit on it:

 

It has 700c wheels and has 7 speed rear mech. It's a Shimano Megarange 14-34.

What would be a good motor/controller combo to put with this? Don't know if it's a free wheel or a cassette, how do you tell? From previous reading I was thinking a Q100 might be good, just not sure which one?

Here's the mech:

 

The bike originally had vee brakes, I want to upgrade the front to hydraulic. Am I right in thinking that Magura HS11's will fit this?

The other thing I want to change is the handlebar stem, 'cos this one creaks. I think it's 20 or 21mm the head stock is 160mm high. Anyone got a suggestion for a replacement?

So, here we go gathering the bits. All help and suggestions wil be appreciated and I'll keep the thread updated.

Thanks in advance.

Ben

14 -34 gearing and 7 speed will be a freewheel a side pic of the cassette wheel out of the dropouts would confirm. Q100h for a freewheel in 260rpm flavour. Controller wise you can run S06P or S as it will run sensored or unsensored but you also need a lcd and pas so it might be equally as good to use the 09 controller kit with the nice modular wiring all of this will fit in the saddle bag fitted , though you may wish to use a soldering iron to burn some vent holes in hear and there to help with some extra cooling.

If you're going to use a rack battery, a front motor might be better. Either way, a Q100H is ideal. 201 rpm for low speed. 260 rpm if you want faster than 15 mph.

Magura HS11 will fit you to a T. But I wonder if those rims will like the extra pressure?

Thanks guys.

Must admit I was a bit concerned about weight distribution. Decided on a rear motor because we suffer from a lot of 'slimy roads' under the trees around here in Wales. I'm used to handling sudden traction loss on my front hub on steep lanes, but thought that a less experienced pedelecer might be caught out by it. What handling affect does all that weight at the back actually have? Riding mine with panniers full of shopping hung on the rack battery seems OK, unless I try some unusual slow speed manouvre.

I guess the 260rpm would develop less torque, how would it's hill climbing be compared to, say, the wife's Big Bear? I fancy the 260 for the occasional 'blast' myself.

That front rim join does look a bit dodgy doesn't it. Maybe that will be the deciding factor on whether to go front or rear.

The Q100H seems to be spec'ed as 350w, is it marked 250w? On the other hand whose gonna look? Is it possible to get a complete kit minus battery?

BPM on Big bear is a beefier hub will take more amps then Q100 so ultimately will give more watts approx 1400w where as Q will fry at that Q about 900/950w, Guys on ES have fried there Q's by trying. 260 is the best of both worlds good climbing ability with good speed a motor that doesn't come in the CST flavour sadly. Also no kit form for H version so components need to be added to wheel/hub or select the 09 controller kit. 350 marked as such but on a stick on label.

Thanks Nealh, as you say Q100h doesn't come with cst. So I'm gonna take D8veh prompt and go with a front hub, plus it'll make the Magura safe.

So , after spending some time deciphering the BMS way of doing things, this is the list I've come up with:

1 Q100H front wheel (700c)

https://bmsbattery.com/ebike-kit/632-q100h-36v350w-front-e-bike-motor-wheel-ebike-kit.html

 

2 S06PW easy assembly waterproof kit

https://bmsbattery.com/ebike-kit/647-s06pw-easy-assembling-waterproof-connector-kit-ebike-kit.html

 

I was going to go for S06S and the Hall sensing PAS that fits on the left, but I think the waterproof kit will make the cables neater. The pas sensor is only 8 pole, will this make things 'lumpy'?

 

Apart from the battery, I think that's it. I hope this will all plug together and I won't have to get the soldering iron out:) yeh right !

Battery, rack and torque bracket I'll get from Cyclezee.

This is my first time putting components together, have I missed anything?

The pas sensor is only 8 pole, will this make things 'lumpy'?

 

Slower start, just over a quarter of a turn, say 1/3. The 12 magnet disk is just under a quarter turn from my experience. That will also depend on your controller set up of course.

if you stick hs11s on there be aware you will need new shifters

 

you have what are known as 1 piece STI units . The shifters and levers are combined.

 

HS11 have their own levers.

 

just something to make sure you dont get caught out at the 11th hour.

if you stick hs11s on there be aware you will need new shifters

 

you have what are known as 1 piece STI units . The shifters and levers are combined.

 

HS11 have their own levers.

 

just something to make sure you dont get caught out at the 11th hour.

 

I was thinking that he would mount the brake lever and drop the gear changer completely. In my 3200 km I never missed changing gears on the chainring.

Yeh thanks TD. New gear changers are on the list. I will keep two rings on the front because the ratio jump from 1st to 2nd is huge and leaves a big 'cadence hole', so I'm hoping that 2nd on the smaller ring will do for the hills here.

On my Carrera I've kept two rings and I use it a lot to get cadence just so, where it feels most comfortable.

 

I've been looking at batteries and I think I've found one to do the job.

 

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/e-Bike-Battery-36v-16Ah-500W-Lithium-Battery-36V-with-2A-charger-20A-BMS-Electric-Scooter/32668163825.html?spm=2114.30010308.3.25.VI91in&ws_ab_test=searchweb201556_0,searchweb201602_4_10057_10056_10065_10068_10055_10054_10069_10059_10058_10073_10017_10071_10070_10060_10061_10052_10062_10053_10050_10051,searchweb201603_3&btsid=efc158c6-d096-466a-84c3-799daaf6c420

 

It says it has a maximum continuous discharge rate of 20A. The controller I've chosen is 16A, so I'm guessing this would do the job. It's unamed 18650 cells, are they going to be any good? I've never bought from these people, it says free shipping to the UK, is that likely to happen or am I going to get a big bill? Will there be duty to pay?

My intention is that this battery would go in a square rear rack bag/box that I've had for years. That way, by using same power connectors as my Ezee, I can still use it on the Carrera, to keep the battery active. I guess the controller could go in the same bag, it's big enough. I realise I would have to bypass the S06P and connect direct to Ezee power leads.

Sorry for all the questions, this ordering seperates is new to me.

Cheers

Ben

yeah but the hs11 brake lever would go to the rear gear shifter in wales.

 

in france i completely agree with what you say but over here we run our brakes the other way round on acount of we drive on the other side

How do I signal I am turning to the right? I put my right hand out while gently squeezing the left (front) brake lever. Yes TD it can be done! Now don't get me started on being left handed (not me, two of my sons, who pointed this out to me) and having to change gears with the right hand!

 

That is the beauty of the HS11 you can dose the braking from gentle to stoppie Of course ben and guests would have to learn that the brake levers are switched over.

hey dont shoot the messenger i didnt make it so that if you need to stop in a hurry while indicating right across oncoming traffic in the middle of the road here in the uk grabbing a handfull of brake instinctively doesnt pitch you over the bars into the road in front of the car oncoming

Tongue in cheek laddie, tongue in cheek!

 

Usually I don't put my arm out in emergency situations and brake with both hands. YMMV... Screaming "I'm turning you <kiwi farmer's son words go here>" works too when you hands are too busy to signal

o_OBUT WOT ABOUT ME BATTERY?

 

P.S. It'll be rear brake on the lft as it should be:eek:. And main changer on the right with the HS11.

Now boys play nicely:)

o_OBUT WOT ABOUT ME BATTERY?

 

Sorry!

 

It says it has a maximum continuous discharge rate of 20A. The controller I've chosen is 16A, so I'm guessing this would do the job. It's unamed 18650 cells, are they going to be any good?

 

They all say 20 A continuous that is what the BMS is set to I suppose. My 10.4 A is rated for 2C continuous and 3C peak. After thrashing around the Basque Country for 15 months it is only good for relatively flat roads or a return trip to the station.

 

Unnamed cells are like the lottery, some people seem to be luckier than others. If you have 80 cells that are reasonably the same quality you will probably have no problems. One bad cell is all that is needed to drag the whole bunch down. As you are going to be drawing 1C it should work out OK. Charge time will be closer to 8 hours than 6 on a fully drained battery.

Thanks Anotherkiwi. Sounds a bit dodgy, so I've just found and e-mailed this guy:

https://www.lithiumelectricbikebattery.com/

Asked him for a price on a pack sized to fit in my rack bag.

Anyone had dealings with them?

On this page he says he only uses new Samsung cells

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/24v-36v-48v-Lithium-Electric-Bike-Battery-Repairs-Re-Fits-upgrades-/321966025601?nma=true&si=6nUDpCRNhH82QHTTkZP0FPxRzRU%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

Edited September 18, 20169 yr by Benjahmin

How does one e-mail Jimmy at Insat? For the life of me I can't seem to find an address. I do find e-bay a bit impenatrable TBH.

How does one e-mail Jimmy at Insat? For the life of me I can't seem to find an address. I do find e-bay a bit impenatrable TBH.

info (at) bga-reworking dot Co dot uk

 

Sent from my HTC 10 using Tapatalk

Thanks Alan, I'll try him now.

I've had an answer from Jimmy, I'll put it up here because what he says may interest others:

 

Hi Ben,

 

Thank you for your email regarding your battery requirement. You have chosen a good time to contact me as I have just acquired the best battery welder in the universe. The welder is the 250i2 EV from Sunstone Engineering and is a pulse arc welder that can weld copper interconnects. Usually nickel is the chosen interconnect material which is 4 times less conductive than copper.

 

Copper is only second best conductor of electrical current to silver (100%copper, 105%silver, 22%nickel), the due to being a difficult metal to weld, nickel is most common. The ultimate battery would be one that has copper interconnects which would have the best power, lowest overall resistance (creates heat), longest life cycle, just to mention a few of its benefits.

 

The choice would be either Panasonic NCR18650B 3350mAh, or NCR18650PF 2900mAh. Using the B cells the capacity would be 17Ah or 14.5Ah with the PF cells (5P10S configuration). Cycle life is 500.

 

I would strongly recommend the Boston Power Swing cells (USA) which would be over 15Ah with a cycle life of 2000-3000. These are excellent cells that NASA use in their robots as well as Volvo in the ev.

 

I normally use 25A continuous current discharge high quality BMS with my builds which means cooler running and higher reliability. The price of the build would be £325-£350 depending on which cells you choose. Needless to say, I'd be using copper interconnects for obvious reasons.

 

Best regards,

Jimmy

 

Anyone heard of the 'Boston Power Swing cells'? Sounds like some sort of 60's elite wife swapping group:eek:

I would stick with the tried and tested Samsung or Panasonic or Sony cells - welded with 100% nickel tabs.

BTW, Boston Power cells are made in Shenzhen and Taiwan.

http://www.bloomberg.com/research/stocks/private/snapshot.asp?privcapId=30029539

Thanks Trex,

I was thinking of asking him for a 4P10S made from Panasonic B cells as this would work out at 13.4Ah, which I think would do.

As for the copper straps, what he says about conductivity makes sense. Is the concern for a bi-metal junction at the battery?

yes, that's what bothers me about copper tabs. The choice is down to the metal used to make the cell cans. Most 18650 cans are made of stainless steel coated with nickel, so we know nickel tabs work well.