Failed on my first big hill

[(NoLongerRegistered#15675)]

That's pure crazy...
Its reckoned both with bikes and cars you have to get over 350bhp/ ton to crack 12 seconds....
Bike looks heavy.. All up 150 k ???

Must be hellish powerful...but looks like its doing it.I,d give him a run...fireblade 7...

Tell you when I was impressed, first 100mph lap in TT Zero... Love to look around those. thinks its passed 110 now..
Lap is 39 miles..
Wonder if they are hub drive ??? Bet not..

 

[soundwave]

 

[(NoLongerRegistered#15675)]

Impressive, bike and rider..
Wonder what motor/ battery.
Racing actually suits regen.
If bike/car isn't accelerating, braking or cornering it ain't winning.
Bikes in Zero are now most valuable !!

 

[soundwave]

this would be faster
http://www.flyingmag.com/aircraft/siemens-unveils-260-kw-electric-aircraft-motor

 

[soundwave]

Specification

Machine Name – SHINDEN SAN

• Overall length/width/height (mm) – 2,125/680/1,130
• Wheelbase (mm) – 1,485
• Ground Clearance (mm) – 130
• Seat Height (mm) – 840
• Total Weight(kg) – 240
• Tyre
  • Front – 120/70ZR17M/C (58W)
  • Rear 200/55ZR17M/C (78W)
• Motor Type – Oil-cooled, 3-phase, brushless motor
• Maximum Output (KW[PS]) – 100 [134]
• Maximum Torque (N-M (kgf-M]) – 220 [22.4]
• Battery Specification – Laminate-type Lithium-ion
• Battery Output Voltage (V) – 370 or more
• $4.3 million

 

[(NoLongerRegistered#15675)]

Think Honda Mugen developed it. ( or paid for it)

Its the future...not long before an electric superbike...my money is on ktm tho...
KTM freeride E is a right piece of kit. Had a go on one , just superb..

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Wonder if they are hub drive ??? Bet not..

Hmmmm! I think it might be tricky to get a 100kw motor into a motorcycle wheel.

 

[soundwave]

http://www.ricardo.com/en-GB/News--Media/Press-releases/News-releases1/2015/Ricardo-develops-next-generation-electric-vehicle-motor-/

https://twitter.com/missionmcycles

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3279798/Is-Apple-building-electric-MOTORBIKE-E-bike-firm-shuts-claiming-Apple-poached-staff.html

 

[mike killay]

Did he pedal?

 

[(NoLongerRegistered#15675)]

Hmmmm! I think it might be tricky to get a 100kw motor into a motorcycle wheel.

Think unsprung weight might affect handling a bit...
This years Mugen made little if any improvements in battery/ motor...did a fair bit of lightening and Showa developed a single sided ( sort of) front suspension...one side took stresses, other side dampening...lowered weight and unsprung weight reduced..
Didn't do a lot with bikes but on cars a kg off wheels/ tyres was worth 3 off car itself on lap times,( unsprung weight reduction and lower rotational mass for acceleration and braking)

With really light unsprung weight you can reduce dampening, or have to.....less mass flying about for dampers to control..
Assumption is always dampers control car, they do partly, but their biggest job is controlling wheels etc...but a bit OT..

 

[(NoLongerRegistered#15675)]

Looks like you're starting to get it, Flud, but there's one more point you need to understand. Most hub-motors in ebikes that you'll see on our roads have internal gearing. Different motors have different internal gearing, which affects the wheel-speed at which the motor can produce high torque and efficiency. Some motors have 5:1, some 8:1, and now we're starting to see higher ratios.

Also, the motor can be wound for different speeds. For a bike with a limited speed of 15 mph, it's typical for the motor to be wound for a maximum speed of around 20 to 22mph so that it makes high power at maximum efficiency in the area of 15 mph. If you want a good hill-climber, you could wind it for a maximum speed of 15 mph, which shifts the whole power and efficiency curves down the rpm axis in direct proportion. Take a typical Bafang 250w SWX motor that's commonly found in ebikes. You can get it in 180, 201, 230, 250, 270, 320 rpm versions, so 180 rpm if you need hill-climbing, 320 rpm if you want speed. The advantage of the crank-drive is that it can do both with the same motor, not that it's better than a hub-motor at either end of the scale.

While I'm on the subject, I opened up one of the recent small Bafang front motors yesterday to find that it now has two-stage gearing inside like the Q100, so it looks like they've increased the reduction ratio from 5:1 to about 8:1. It has helical gears on the motor output shaft and straight-cut ones to the hub.

Seems you may well have convinced me, but not everybody sees it that way ???

 

[Deleted member 4366]

People have been spreading these myths for years. They're only showing their ignorance. If they qualified their statements, we might get nearer the truth, like, "out of the bikes that you find in an average ebike shop, the crank drives will probably climb btter than the hub-motors "

 

[soundwave]

https://proaddicts.com/es/video?video=209

 

[(NoLongerRegistered#15675)]

O

People have been spreading these myths for years. They're only showing their ignorance. If they qualified their statements, we might get nearer the truth, like, "out of the bikes that you find in an average ebike shop, the crank drives will probably climb btter than the hub-motors "

I,m just glad I found the sole enlightened forum dedicated to legal pedelecs. ( bet my smilie doesn't show)

Another unenlightened journo...
just all over place...

 

[danielrlee]

O

I,m just glad I found the sole enlightened forum dedicated to legal pedelecs. ( bet my smilie doesn't show)View attachment 13678

Another unenlightened journo...
just all over place...

I think that linking to information, or at the very least including a source, might help when putting forward an argument. Anyone can write anything on the Internet, so random unqualified screenshots aren't going to do you any favours.

 

[(NoLongerRegistered#15675)]

I,m not asking for favours. I,m pointing out there is a vast amount of " information" and "evidence" contradicting the concepts generally held on here..

Both " screenshots" taken from highly regarded sources.( and different)

I,ll post sources, thought it was on heading.
( ebike " an introduction" )
You know full well the views expressed are quite common, and quoted in most other sources.
Criticising my finding / posting/ not quoting source does not change the common held belief expressed in the quotes.

 

[Izzyekerslike]

What I find absolutely astonishing is that I come on here in good faith,in that I,m neither promoting or selling anything, insult no one,put nobody down , accept and post that yes hub drives have their place and obviously suit many happy riders but offer practical help to OP ( loan of my bike), offer to meet up at similar hill to try and objectively work out issues bloke is facing and along way dare to suggest for reasons outlined that perhaps he,d be better suited with a CD unit . Only criticism I have offered has been to Amp bikes and supplying shop for not helping..Result..I,m trolling, I,m ignorant. I don't listen. I don't understand. Shut up. Offer of races to prove superiority of hub and not a word from anyone...
Then I mis spell some posters name, yes deliberately and some body is all hurt.
This place is insular. It needs new members.
I,ll stop posting.
OP good luck.

Don't stop posting it's always good to hear different points of view from informed people.. Plus I think most of us on the forum enjoy the exchanges it adds spice to what would otherwise be maybe a little mundane for most readers. Don't take things personally stay with us and fight your corner.

 

[RobF]

I,m not asking for favours. I,m pointing out there is a vast amount of " information" and "evidence" contradicting the concepts generally held on here..

Both " screenshots" taken from highly regarded sources.( and different)

I,ll post sources, thought it was on heading.
( ebike " an introduction" )
You know full well the views expressed are quite common, and quoted in most other sources.
Criticising my finding / posting/ not quoting source does not change the common held belief expressed in the quotes.

The 'concepts' are not generally held on here.

A couple of the big beasts on the forum make a lot of noise, as such folk do.

But much of what they post is cobblers, and certainly not generally agreed with.

Your general point is a good one.

A quality crank drive is a good real world solution for those who want to be legal, do decent length rides, and not have to carry kilos and kilos of spare batteries.

 

[trex]

flud, if you compare the two bikes, your Haibike against the Wisper 905SE torque, then most of what you said is applicable. But if you generalize your comments, then they are not.

 

[danielrlee]

Flud, I'm pretty sure that my last post doesn't read as if I am criticising or attacking you in any way, yet your reply reads (to me at least) in an extremely defensive tone. I was only trying to put across the fact that qualified evidence from a verified source holds much more weight and will only help your side of the discussion.