eMTB conversion

[baldylox]

I would like to buy a KTM eLycanP but cannot really justify the high price!

However I have a 2010 Giant trance X2 full suspension MTB which I was thinking of converting to an ebike with the BBS01 350w kit with a 15ah bottle mount battery.
The problem is that (although I've read many positive reviews on here and endless sphere and indeed seen an example of this build on the very same bike) it appears that the motor is slung too low due to the frame and this would impede ground clearance.
An alternative to this would appear to be the CST (350/500w?) with the similar battery but what would be the best controller combination for this, 36/48v set up?
My needs are for off road (mainly rough tracks) and only really need assistance for the steeper hills so probably don't require too much speed but lots of torque. I would like to manage 15 mph uphill with some pedal assist but would also like a (thumb) throttle for a bit of "easy"
lazy cruising.
I am 5'11'' @ 15 stone, not overly fit and heading to my first half century.
I fully expect d8veh to be able to offer some advice as my requirements appear to be similar to those of his CST based build on his full suspension MTB (Rocky Mountain?)
I see that there are different models of the CST and would be grateful for any advice on which may be the most appropriate, cost is not so much of an issue here but stealth/reliability off road are.

Many thanks in anticipation.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

It would be worth an Email to Xofo. At one time they said they're not interested in selling go non-trade people, but I think they changed that. Ask if they can provide a kit with this battery at 14.5ah, 500w CST motor. controller, LCD, throttle and PAS with waterproof harness.

http://www.szxfmotor.com/display.asp?id=796
http://www.szxfmotor.com/display.asp?id=780
http://www.szxfmotor.com/display.asp?id=769

Give them the links to avoid confusion. Don't use too many words, and no idioms - just simple English.

You have to think about building the wheel. You could ask them for a "spoke rim" to use their words; however, I don't know whether they'll give the right off-set on the rim, so you might have to dish it yourself. Their kit is very cheap and very well thought out.

If you can't get tit from them, then get the 500w CST wheel from BMSBattery with the S12S controller, LCD, Wheel-speed sensor, throttle and PAS plus a spoke key and a pair of torque arms. You'll have to choose a battery from somewhere. Make sure that it has a high enough discharge rate (at least 25 amps)

Stick to 36v and 25 amps. 48v will be faster, but less efficient for slow stuff,

 

[baldylox]

Thanks d8veh,

I've not seen too much information on the XOFO motor and a quick look at their website indicated that they are due to release a duel speed motor. Any experience of this and is it likely to be a better bet.

Another concern is the fact that I have hydraulic brakes and would ideally want a motor cut off in the system. How easy would this be to achieve, I see that the woosh CST kit has this option.
So 36v seems the way to go, does the bottle mount type battery @ 36v achieve the required 25+ amps?

 

[trex]

if you could wait until end of July, Woosh will have the 8-Fun 350W BPM CST in stock for a little bit more than their Big Bear kit.

 

[baldylox]

Thanks trex,

As I'm in no rush the woosh 350w CST may well be an option if it's able to meet my requirements.
Incidentally, the image of the TranceX you posted is a newer model than mine (looks like a 2012), as I have the s shaped x bar but it does show the shape of the frame at the BB which means the BBS01 is a no no.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Dual speed motors are half way between a crank-drive and normal hub-motor. They can get really good climbing power from a small ("legal") motor, which is their main advantage. I don't know the power of the Xofo one. You can't beat the simplicity and sheer grunt of the 500w Xofo motor. It makes the bike really easy to ride because it has power and torque whatever gear you're in, which is much better for off-road stuff.

Xofo make motors for a lot of OEM bikes, but you wouldn't know it because the OEMs don't want their logo on it. They're a nice friendly caring company. I visited their factory with Andrew from Oxygen. Xipi used to use Xofo motors. I don't know if they still do.

Sorting a switch for hydraulic brakes can be done in a number of ways depending how much you want to spend.

You can buy a Tektro Auriga E-comp for about £100. Juicy Bikes used to do them, or you might be able to get one as a spare part from Kudos, or search the web.

For about £25, you can get a Bionx in-line hydraulic brake switch, for which you have to cut your brake line to splice it in. You need to bleed the system afterwards.

Lastly, you can make your own switch using a reed switch and magnet or a hall sensor and magnet. You only have to fix the bits so that the magnet moves to and from the reed/hall. This solution costs about £1, but requires ingenuity.

 

[baldylox]

Is the reed switch solution the one which woosh employ? I wonder how easy it would be to connect to controller if not the bespoke for the kit?
I like the idea of plenty of grunt/torque especially for the times when stood up on pedals negotiating the tricky stuff, maybe with throttle?

 

[trex]

woosh use a hall sensor attached to the cylinder and a magnetic ring that you tie to the brake handle - that's the theory, I was promised a couple for my bike - they've lost the box of these sensors in the last container so they have no hydraulic brake sensors at the moment.

 

[baldylox]

Many thanks for your advice so far, I wonder if you could offer some more of your wisdom and advise on my proposed build and keep me on track...

Looking at the core of the kit required for the build from BMS battery I have specified;

Bafang CST 36V 500W REAR Driving E-Bike Motor Wheel
$264.80Wheel Size (24",26" or 28"): 26

S12S 500W Torque Simulation Sine Wave Controller
$34.00

Thumb Level Throttle without Handle
$3.80

PAS--Pulse Padel Assistant Sensor With 12 PCS Magnets
$6.90

S-LCD3 LCD Meter for S-Series Controlers
$29.90

Total products:$339.40 (around £200 so far)

Obviously postage will be added and although I have not ordered yet so I would like to know the likely costs of both postage and customs charges.

Also no wiring or cabling, connection/connectors or wiring seen on the website that appeared obvious to me (what will I require here), nor brake sensors or battery at this stage (probably will get the bottle mount type as seen on the bike with BBS kit shown above to get 25+amps and reed sensor type brake sensors as previously discussed).

Basically, does this look sensible or have I missed anything essential?

 

[Deleted member 4366]

You have to get the wheel-speed sensor as well. It would be a good idea to get one of their $1 spoke keys too, as you'll be needing one.

The connections are all pretty straight forward. You'll have to solder your own connections on the power wires for the controller and battery. I use Deans. Another good idea is to cut off the bullet and barrel connectors for the phase wires because they overheat and melt the shrouds, which can cause a short and knackered controller. You don't need them because there's a connector on the motor end.

Make sure that you get a battery that can do at least 20 amps continuous (not max) and at least 15aH.

You have to go to stage 2 of the checkout to see the shipping cost. Duty will be £15 to £40 per shipment, so if you get your battery elsewhere, you'll pay twice.

 

[baldylox]

Thanks again d8veh,

Regarding the battery, BMSB didn't appear to stock the type I'm considering so will probably have to source elsewhere.
Does anyone know if the one which woosh sell can provide the necessary 20 amps continuous?
It does appear on the surface to be good value.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

I think it's a bit under-rated for that. Have a look at Em3ev.com. They do them, but fairly pricey.

 

[baldylox]

It doesn't look like there are any of the type of battery I'm after that can manage the 20 amps continuous which has been recommended, will a lower value make a big difference or can more be squeezed out by other means?

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Don't scrimp on the battery. If you're going to get a crappy battery, you might as well get a crappy motor. Did you not look at this one?

http://em3ev.com/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=35&product_id=160

 

[baldylox]

Thanks again d8veh,

A case of wood for the trees...
A 16.5ah unit runs in at around £300 with a couple of chargers, again the extra charges for delivery will up that a bit.
Has anyone else got experience with this type of battery, specifically with the 500w CST?

 

[Deleted member 4366]

It's quite popular on Endless-Sphere.

 

[baldylox]

Splendid... It looks like a plan for later this summer, I'm in no real hurry and I'm guessing it won't be quite "plug&play" so I will have to ask for advice when I get stuck with the build as it's my first.
Many thanks again.

 

[baldylox]

I may have run into problem in that the frame battery pack could be a bit of a tight squeeze in my frame (an 18" unlike the 20" in the earlier image).
With that in mind and that I want to keep the weight distribution nicely balanced, I may need to consider a triangle bag with a custom cell/BMS arrangement. Would it be sensible to place the controller here too?
Suggestions appreciated.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Yes, unless you run it continuously above its rating. It's rating is half its maximum current.