Help! Continuously Faulty Bosch Ebike. I want a replacement

[Captaintomo]

Hey guys first post here.

I have an Orbea city bike. Purchased roughly 13 months ago now purchased from an online retailer.

Upon arrival it had to go to my local bike shop twice for various mecahnical fixes. Headset missing parts etc. Retailer was good about it and reimbursed costs.

Hoever in March it began developing electrical issues where it would restart constantly. Sent it back to retailer and they replaced some wires. This took over a month.

Few months later same thing happened but a lot worse in additon to error codes on the Bosch Screen. Once again it got sent back and they reckoned it would need a new motor. However in talks with Bosch they decided to replace all the lights and cabling.

I took delivery of it again and on out of the box the rear light didnt work. They took it back and apologised because they didn't actually replace the lights.

So i've just received it back for the third time and the rear light is dim. Upon inspection the cables into the rear light literally just fell out. Also checked the voltage on the rear light cable terminals and it's 7v (the front is 12/13v). Before it got sent away it was the full 12v!

Something weird with this bikes electrics going on and I do not trust it anymore! Also this bike has been off road for three months of the year!

The retailer has come back with an offer of either me taking it the a local repairer to get it fixed and reimburse £50 or I send it back for a new bike but they will knock off fare wear and tear when giving me a price for the bike.

What a nightmare, Any advice appreciated! Thanks

 

[Andy-Mat]

Hey guys first post here.

I have an Orbea city bike. Purchased roughly 13 months ago now purchased from an online retailer.

Upon arrival it had to go to my local bike shop twice for various mecahnical fixes. Headset missing parts etc. Retailer was good about it and reimbursed costs.

Hoever in March it began developing electrical issues where it would restart constantly. Sent it back to retailer and they replaced some wires. This took over a month.

Few months later same thing happened but a lot worse in additon to error codes on the Bosch Screen. Once again it got sent back and they reckoned it would need a new motor. However in talks with Bosch they decided to replace all the lights and cabling.

I took delivery of it again and on out of the box the rear light didnt work. They took it back and apologised because they didn't actually replace the lights.

So i've just received it back for the third time and the rear light is dim. Upon inspection the cables into the rear light literally just fell out. Also checked the voltage on the rear light cable terminals and it's 7v (the front is 12/13v). Before it got sent away it was the full 12v!

Something weird with this bikes electrics going on and I do not trust it anymore! Also this bike has been off road for three months of the year!

The retailer has come back with an offer of either me taking it the a local repairer to get it fixed and reimburse £50 or I send it back for a new bike but they will knock off fare wear and tear when giving me a price for the bike.

What a nightmare, Any advice appreciated! Thanks

Read and research all you can on Pedelec and similar forums about Bosch bikes and mid motor bikes generally, before making any decisions further, is my best advice.
Some work for years, but far too many don't, and they are made to be very difficult to fix, and parts are NOT sold to private persons by Bosch, only to their own outlets, who are also not allowed to do all the normal things an average bike shop does.
Recently on Pedelec, a Bosch owner, told of one model, that a repaired replacement (NOT NEW!) motor costs around 800 UK Pounds, many average hub motor bikes cost less new than that, and are complete!! Plus almost any LBS or good DIYer, can repair them!
You could not give me any mid motor bike as a present! I would give it to someone else to have problems with! Might even pay them to take it away.........
regards
Andy

 

[Captaintomo]

Yeah I'm well aware of the challenges surrounding Bosch and how they operate similarly to Apple and Tesla. The hope was that it would be reliable for a good few years at least and if there would be any issues they would be repaired fully. How I was wrong.

 

[Andy-Mat]

Yeah I'm well aware of the challenges surrounding Bosch and how they operate similarly to Apple and Tesla. The hope was that it would be reliable for a good few years at least and if there would be any issues they would be repaired fully. How I was wrong.

Now you mention it, that is a really good comment, "similar to Apple and Tesla". I fully agree.
Ever since while working for a US computer company, someone (a director) literally forced Apple computers on the firm, which within 2 years were so outdated, the firm literally threw them out, and the director too.
Since then, only my daughters have iPhones, not me!
Someone else posted today with a Bosch mid motor with a broken gear wheel, with photos, dreadful! See here:-

Bosch planned obsolescence

The engine on my 2012 Moustache bike broke down, and it turned out the main cog wheel was ... broken in half. Because it's made of plastic. And you can't replace just the crappy cog, you have to change the whole engine. I didn't expect this, although my dealer said I was lucky it lasted so long...

www.pedelecs.co.uk

regards
Andy
PS. Do keep updating here, as I am very interested as to how you get on.....

 

[kangooroo]

If problems started shortly following delivery and were documented, as it appears they were, then additional faults occurred and have been ongoing before and beyond the 6 month period, I would be wanting a replacement bike rather than a string of repairs. The burden of proof is on you to prove it was defective at the time of purchase, which it appears to be so I would be wanting to return it to the retailer but would expect a small amount to be deducted to reflect the albeit limited use you have had out of the bike so far.

 

[Amoto65]

Which Orbea model bike is it?

 

[Captaintomo]

Orbea keram asphalt 10. It has got 3000 miles on the clock. Mechanically it's in amazing shape as I service it very regularly. Just wish the electrics would hold up but there's nothing I can help with there.

 

[Andy-Mat]

Orbea keram asphalt 10. It has got 3000 miles on the clock. Mechanically it's in amazing shape as I service it very regularly. Just wish the electrics would hold up but there's nothing I can help with there.

If you follow "kangooroo's" advice, the only problem that I see is that you still end up with the same/similar bike.....
But if you do go that way, when starting discussions about fair wear and tear value, ask the Guy how long should such a bike last! That gives you a better handle on just how much wear should cost!
And therefore he cannot say 2 years for instance, now can her? I think that a reasonable e-bike should last 10 years, with a once a year service, plus new brake pads and an occasional new chain/sprockets, when needed.
My first e-bike, a big store cheapo in 2010, lasted me 7 years (was 12 months old when I bought it, hardly used!), and was still in running order when I gave it away.....same battery too!
Brakes changed several times, tyres between 1 and 2 years, chain once, new rear gear cluster once.

Andy

 

[Captaintomo]

Yes I agree. Say he comes back and knocks 50% off that means the bike should only last 2 years! I purposely bought a premium ebike for reliability as I rely on it.

I've emailed the finance company as it was bought with one of those zero percent interest deals to see if they can help. From what I can see it should be covered under section 75. If not, financial ombudsman next step.

Thanks for the help so far guys

 

[Captaintomo]

Hey guys.

Just thought I'd give an update for anyone interested.

In the end the bike got sent back 5 times in total for the same restarting problem.

Last time the bike went back in January Tredz thought the control unit was faulty however either Bosch or Orbea insisted on sending out replacement lights for the second time. Obviously this wouldn't work.

I kicked off a fuss and got the finance company I bought it through to investigate being sold a faulty product.

With my bike with them for roughly two months tredz tried offering me 50% of the bikes value. No good.

However for whatever reason, maybe with the threat of pressure from the finance company they finally offered a full refund which I accepted. Glad to get that POS bike off my hands.

In fairness to tredz they have acted well throughout all this. Accepting the bike back 5 times in total at no cost to me with shipment costs etc and no hassle from the guys at Tredz.

Happy days.

 

[Deleted member 33385]

Hey guys.

Just thought I'd give an update for anyone interested.

In the end the bike got sent back 5 times in total for the same restarting problem.

Last time the bike went back in January Tredz thought the control unit was faulty however either Bosch or Orbea insisted on sending out replacement lights for the second time. Obviously this wouldn't work.

I kicked off a fuss and got the finance company I bought it through to investigate being sold a faulty product.

With my bike with them for roughly two months tredz tried offering me 50% of the bikes value. No good.

However for whatever reason, maybe with the threat of pressure from the finance company they finally offered a full refund which I accepted. Glad to get that POS bike off my hands.

In fairness to tredz they have acted well throughout all this. Accepting the bike back 5 times in total at no cost to me with shipment costs etc and no hassle from the guys at Tredz.

Happy days.

Great result! What ebike will you buy to replace that nightmare ride?

 

[Andy-Mat]

Hey guys.

Just thought I'd give an update for anyone interested.

In the end the bike got sent back 5 times in total for the same restarting problem.

Last time the bike went back in January Tredz thought the control unit was faulty however either Bosch or Orbea insisted on sending out replacement lights for the second time. Obviously this wouldn't work.

I kicked off a fuss and got the finance company I bought it through to investigate being sold a faulty product.

With my bike with them for roughly two months tredz tried offering me 50% of the bikes value. No good.

However for whatever reason, maybe with the threat of pressure from the finance company they finally offered a full refund which I accepted. Glad to get that POS bike off my hands.

In fairness to tredz they have acted well throughout all this. Accepting the bike back 5 times in total at no cost to me with shipment costs etc and no hassle from the guys at Tredz.

Happy days.

Well done, and many thanks for the clearly written update - you won the war!
You used, correctly, all your fully legal methods to finally get your money back, just as you should, when something is sold but is not "Fit for purpose!".
And you were MOST patient as well.....
I wonder just how many people, over the years, have given up and accepted a 50% price back offer? 50% probably being very close to the price paid by the bike shop "wholesale", so that in the end, they still made money, as they get the bike back and all its "parts".....
This should be a good lesson for anyone today, who is currently searching for a quality e-bike, say on Pedelec, for full info's as to what type/make/style of e-bike one should buy for reliability, serviceability and long term life/usage.
Not forgetting the price paid for those without access to large sums of money for such a bike.
That was probably the best news I have read this year on Pedelec, and I am sure that I am not alone in my thoughts either, in that you did a great job all round.
Many thanks for all the updates and information, you will help many in preventing them buying expensive rubbish, assuming that they do their searches diligently, before buying of course......
Kind regards from
Andy

 

[RoadieRoger]

For your next Ebike I would put your business with the firms that support this Site . They have back-up and readily give advice and Support .

 

[mike killay]

Bosch is actually short for BOSH.

 

[Deleted member 33385]

Turning Tredz's relationship with the finance company into leverage is a new angle I hadn't considered, they probably didn't have a playbook for that. Sellers usually have plans for dealing with accusations of fraud from Banks and Credit Cards. Well done!

 

[Captaintomo]

Turning Tredz's relationship with the finance company into leverage is a new angle I hadn't considered, they probably didn't have a playbook for that. Sellers usually have plans for dealing with accusations of fraud from Banks and Credit Cards. Well done!

I think what happened was Tredz received the brand new light set from Orbea, fitted them and then quickly realised it was game over when it didn't fix the problem. The finance company told me a week before that as everything is now on file that if you have any more issues after the latest "fix" they would refund the money as they have had plenty of times to sort the bike properly. So yeah i think Tredz had no choice. Funny that one week before they tried giving me 50%.... LOL! In the year i had the bike it was at tredz for 4/5 months of that! No chance.

As for my replacement bike. I picked up a Haibike Sduro Trekking 4 from my LOCAL shop today. In terms of quality it is a real step up in feel from the Orbea and now with local support should anything go wrong I am happy. I did contemplate going down the road of buying hub motors etc and diy'ing it but as I use rely on the bike i wanted something off the shelf. Also the bike insurance company i use don't insure diy e-bikes. I would go this route if it was just a fun bike to kick about on as i am quite mechanical so it would be a fun project.

Anyway happy days!