BT-WIN ELOPS 900E EBIKE KEEPS CUTTING OUT

[Toptiler]

New to this sort of thing so please bare with me!
Had this bike over 2 years
Never ridden in the wet/Rain
It's Done 450 miles.
Not a bit of trouble, But now it has an intermittent fault.
It will run fine for 5 minutes, then will turn itself off,
pressing the power on button
On The Bigstone C300 LCD
will restart the system, but after 20 minutes of Riding or so will not turn back on unless turned of at the Battery switch. Then will only work intermittently.
I Have disconnected and reconnected all the Juliet connections,
Checked the battery Terminals.
The Battery holds a charge fine and was replaced a year ago
The Controller number is
CE:G3M20211-1592-16

Google search says it's a Lishui
Any advice or thoughts on what is the Problem?
And what Other Tests can I perform?
Thanks in Advance.

 

[cyclebuddy]

Do the battery bars on the display go down quickly and then the display cuts-out completely too OR just the motor loses power yet the display stays on?

450 miles over two years suggests the bike is sitting around an awful lot between rides, and that you needed a replacement battery after just the first year suggests you may not be looking after it properly... like leaving it under or over-charged when it's sitting about for long spells?

 

[Toptiler]

Do the battery bars on the display go down quickly and then the display cuts-out completely too OR just the motor loses power yet the display stays on?

450 miles over two years suggests the bike is sitting around an awful lot between rides, and that you needed a replacement battery after just the first year suggests you may not be looking after it properly... like leaving it under or over-charged when it's sitting about for long spells?

The Display just goes off no power
The battery bars remain the same !
In fact The Battery seems to hold its charge fine!
Always kept it inside and never get any lower than 30%
Charged up for winter and still fully charged in February

The Battery was Replaced under warranty by Decathlon!
Thanks!

 

[saneagle]

The Display just goes off no power
The battery bars remain the same !
In fact The Battery seems to hold its charge fine!
Always kept it inside and never get any lower than 30%
Charged up for winter and still fully charged in February

The Battery was Replaced under warranty by Decathlon!
Thanks!

When the LCD goes off, the only reason is that it's lost battery voltage, which means either the battery is switching off or there's a connection issue.

The battery can switch off due to too much current. Too much current would occur when one of the motor wires isn't connected properly, so first and easiest step is to check both ends of the motor cable very carefully. Any 9 pin connectors must be all the way to the line, not just in tight. Bullet connectors can look like they're in tight when they're not. Check the battery bullet connectors too. As you have the controller out, I guess we can eliminate melted motor bullet connectors, which is a common cause of your issue. Maybe inspect them carefully anyway if you have them.

The next thing to check is the that the pins in the battery receiver are not burnt or otherwise damaged. Burning happens if you take the battery out and re-insert it when switched on. Always make sure that the battery is switched off when you re-attach it.

Other than that, is the possibility of cable damage. Sometimes caple ties zipped too tight squish the wires inside the sheathing, which can cause shorts or breaks.

If batteries are knackered or out of balance, they normally switch back on by themselves after shutting down, but if you have to physically switch it off and on again, I think I' d be looking for a short somewhere rather than a break.

Finally, always worth checking is the fuse and fuse-holder in the battery. It's sometimes accessible from the outside, but you might need to unscrew the case to check it properly.

 

[Nealh]

9 year old controller and a lishui system , tbh I would spend £80 and replace both controller and lcd with a KT. You would thank us later as you experience much better rider control and power use.

What is the battery voltage hot off the charger and an hour or two later when rested ?

 

[Nealh]

Doesn't make sense or does decathlon warranty extend to 9 years ?
I can't see decathlon giving you a new battery on a 9 year old bike going by the controller age/date ?
At most I can see them maybe giving you a used second hand (maybe tired ) battery which is likely the cause or issue.

 

[Toptiler]

When the LCD goes off, the only reason is that it's lost battery voltage, which means either the battery is switching off or there's a connection issue.

The battery can switch off due to too much current. Too much current would occur when one of the motor wires isn't connected properly, so first and easiest step is to check both ends of the motor cable very carefully. Any 9 pin connectors must be all the way to the line, not just in tight. Bullet connectors can look like they're in tight when they're not. Check the battery bullet connectors too. As you have the controller out, I guess we can eliminate melted motor bullet connectors, which is a common cause of your issue. Maybe inspect them carefully anyway if you have them.

The next thing to check is the that the pins in the battery receiver are not burnt or otherwise damaged. Burning happens if you take the battery out and re-insert it when switched on. Always make sure that the battery is switched off when you re-attach it.

Other than that, is the possibility of cable damage. Sometimes caple ties zipped too tight squish the wires inside the sheathing, which can cause shorts or breaks.

If batteries are knackered or out of balance, they normally switch back on by themselves after shutting down, but if you have to physically switch it off and on again, I think I' d be looking for a short somewhere rather than a break.

Finally, always worth checking is the fuse and fuse-holder in the battery. It's sometimes accessible from the outside, but you might need to unscrew the case to check it properly.

Thanks Sam I went through all the connections like you said
Even though I tried that once!

Update
I have checked the front motor cable connector, Pas connector, LCD connection, brake wires all seemeed Fine!
Loosened one of the cable Ties that was quite tight at the frame cable entry under the seat
reconnected everything
And it was fine for over 10 miles
And me Stop starting the bike, frequently to try and replicate the issues
It Never went off once
Fingers Crossed now !

 

[saneagle]

Thanks Sam I went through all the connections like you said
Even though I tried that once!

Update
I have checked the front motor cable connector, Pas connector, LCD connection, brake wires all seemeed Fine!
Loosened one of the cable Ties that was quite tight at the frame cable entry under the seat
reconnected everything
And it was fine for over 10 miles
And me Stop starting the bike, frequently to try and replicate the issues
It Never went off once
Fingers Crossed now !

Thanks for the update. Be lucky.

 

[Nealh]

Cable ties are a cause of wireing issues , too tight and the pinch the wiring.
One is better replacing all cable ties with velcro straps.

 

[Toptiler]

Update
Had the battery tested, 97% health apparently
What was found,
the cable tie just behind the cable Entry on the rear of the frame had cut into the 3 in 1 cable, 4 wires were partially severed, I have pulled some slack through and soldered the wires,

Tested and rode fine for 20 miles then: IT started turning off again,
Reset from the screen bike comes back on, then intermittently cutting out AGAIN AARGH!
Obviously buying a new cable would be ideal, but Google isn't my friend! Nothing that matches the connections.
I thought about buying a cable and splicing a piece in from the controller housing up until the front of the frame cable entry?
Or can anyone share some Tips advice?
Thanks for reading through the loong post!

 

[Benjahmin]

You are going to need a digital volt meter. Available from as little as a fiver on 'tinternet.
What does 97% healthy mean? What test was it, who did it?
You need to measure the battery voltage as stated earlier.
It should be just under 42 volts hot off the charger, settling to around 41.5 if healthy.
What size is the battery? This is a figure quoted in Ah (Amphours) somewhere on the battery.
You say it started cutting out after 20miles. Was this on flat or hilly terrain, high assistance or low?
As it's now resetting from the screen this sounds like it could be voltage sag. This is when the voltage output of the battery sags under load and goes below the low voltage cutoff setting, and so the system turns off. Voltage recovery can be quick but sag will re-occur, at shorter intervals, when battery is under load.
The bike has not had much use and, from what you said earlier, the battery has been stored fully charged. This may be the cause of some issues.

 

[Nealh]

Crikey that trunk cable is a mess as is the other smaller one and not surprised you are having issues.
First job is to replace the trunk cable but imv you are better spending about £80 - £100 and replacing the Lishui system with a KT current control system.
Buy a controller kit with matching display along with the trunk cable, all items are avilable freely in the open market where as Lishui is 99% an OEM product. Topbike kit is a good reatiler to go to t or via shops on AliExpress.
Remember snip all cable ties off and repalce all ties with 8 -10mm width black vecro , velcro will hold all wiirng tightly and securely but without the pinch effect.

Once one is sorted control system wise then one can turn their attention to any battery issues, it is pointless trying to sort out any possible battery issue with such a poor control system in it's current state.
One can't deal with two scenarios unti the first major one (poor wiring ) is remedied.

 

[Ghost1951]

Update
Had the battery tested, 97% health apparently
What was found,
the cable tie just behind the cable Entry on the rear of the frame had cut into the 3 in 1 cable, 4 wires were partially severed, I have pulled some slack through and soldered the wires,
View attachment 58364View attachment 58365
Tested and rode fine for 20 miles then: IT started turning off again,
Reset from the screen bike comes back on, then intermittently cutting out AGAIN AARGH!
Obviously buying a new cable would be ideal, but Google isn't my friend! Nothing that matches the connections.
I thought about buying a cable and splicing a piece in from the controller housing up until the front of the frame cable entry?
Or can anyone share some Tips advice?
Thanks for reading through the loong post!

I'm assuming Toptiler properly insulated those repaired wires after photographing the repair.... Of course he did.

 

[Nealh]

This a straight forward swap out kit, replacin gitem like for like .
One may or may not have to change the two connectors for the controller connection in the compartment located at the front of the battery.
Ebike Controller 15A Waterproof for 250W Hub Motor Kit with KT Display LCD4 LCD7 and Electric Bike - AliExpress 201355758

 

[Toptiler]

You are going to need a digital volt meter. Available from as little as a fiver on 'tinternet.
What does 97% healthy mean? What test was it, who did it?
You need to measure the battery voltage as stated earlier.
It should be just under 42 volts hot off the charger, settling to around 41.5 if healthy.
What size is the battery? This is a figure quoted in Ah (Amphours) somewhere on the battery.
You say it started cutting out after 20miles. Was this on flat or hilly terrain, high assistance or low?
As it's now resetting from the screen this sounds like it could be voltage sag. This is when the voltage output of the battery sags under load and goes below the low voltage cutoff setting, and so the system turns off. Voltage recovery can be quick but sag will re-occur, at shorter intervals, when battery is under load.
The bike has not had much use and, from what you said earlier, the battery has been stored fully charged. This may be the cause of some issues.

Sorry about the late reply,
I'm not getting notifications!
I did do a multimeter Test,
Battery was 41.4v fully charged
36.7v half charged.
the 97% health was me reading an online chart !
I Took it out and rode up and down a hill 3 times no problem, then on a flat road it cut out,
turned straight back on again!
The Damaged wires were covered up with electrical tape to test the bike , I'm Thinking of throwing a new kt controller system at it, but it doesn't appear compatible with the motor cable,
Anyone know what cable this is?
Thanks!

 

[saneagle]

Sorry about the late reply,
I'm not getting notifications!
I did do a multimeter Test,
Battery was 41.4v fully charged
36.7v half charged.
the 97% health was me reading an online chart !
I Took it out and rode up and down a hill 3 times no problem, then on a flat road it cut out,
turned straight back on again!
The Damaged wires were covered up with electrical tape to test the bike , I'm Thinking of throwing a new kt controller system at it, but it doesn't appear compatible with the motor cable,
Anyone know what cable this is?
Thanks!

They have their own connector. Whatever motor cable you have, cut off whatever is at the controller end, cut off the connectors on the controller and solder the wires directly together so that your new KT controller will have a long motor cable attached with the correct connector for the motor.

 

[Nealh]

Agree, keep the motor cable connector and solder the controller end to the controller connector. Just like the suntour hub motor connector is different as well so the guys have to keep the cable connector and solder the new controller to the cable ends.

 

[Toptiler]

Thanks Sam and Nealh,
Will the colour coded wires match like for like?

 

[saneagle]

Thanks Sam and Nealh,
Will the colour coded wires match like for like?

The colours will probably be the same, but that might not help. You need to rig up some temporary arrangement with screw connector blocks to test because you might have to go through all 36 combinations until you get one that works. Actually 3 out of the 36 will work. How quickly you find a working combination is luck. If you're really lucky, colour to colour will work first time. Do not attempt to keep the connector blocks as a permament solution or you will get trouble.

 

[Nealh]

If all is well and the pedelec gods are with you colour to coour will work first time, as said use a strip connector block to test before making permanent solder joints or using the original Hall or Phase connectors .
For phase I dispense with bullets and use MT60 tri connectors , for the Halls I still use the white DJ7061 supplied block as they make fault finding easier.