Brexit, for once some facts.

jonathan.agnew

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Starmer has a difficult job to do.
He needs to steer clear of clearly unworkable policies of Corbyn, Johnson and Truss.
There is very little left on the table.
Can he preserve what's left of the social safety net? If he can, then who is doing the work that the poorer Brits don't want to do?
Can he level up? I can't see how that's possible.
Can he borrow enough money to turn the economy around? If he can, then how much tax can he charge the better off among us?
Can he take us back to the EU, if not, then can he get us back inside the single market or the customs union?
Can he wean our universities off selling cheap degrees?
Wish you were right. Am afraid that's the Stockholm syndrome syndrome speaking. Starmers new labour will in reality be like teflon Tony on steroids. Anyone remember public private partnerships? That blairite fiasco that cost the taxpayer billions (that ended up in guess who's pockets?) will be nothing compared to the privatising by the backdoor of the nhs, what's left of a welfare state starmer will inflict. And post truss, Boris he will get away with it, the electorate have lost any critical faculties it may have had.
 
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Woosh

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I can't say that I am sad to see Johnson and Dorries leaving.
Johnson's leaving statement confirms what we think of him: me, me, me. He lives in a parallel universe where he can do no wrong.
I wonder what zlatan has to say on this news.
 
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Woosh

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Sunak said this morning:

"When it comes to honours, honours and Boris Johnson, [he] asked me to do something that I wasn’t prepared to do, because I didn’t think it was right.
That was to either overrule the HOLAC [House of Lords appointments] committee or to make promises for people.
Now, I wasn’t prepared to do that. As I said, I didn’t think it was right. And if people don’t like that, then tough.”

Apparently, Nadine Dorries and Nigel Adams were dropped from the list so they resigned.
 

Woosh

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Johnson says that Sunak talked rubbish but actually, do you think the HOLAC stiched up Nadine Dorries? I think she is an idiot but...
 

Woosh

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He'd say Boris will be back.
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I reckon he'll probably be back but in the HoL rather than as an MP.
The work isn't hard and there is no timetable to keep.
 
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flecc

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Oct 25, 2006
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Johnson says that Sunak talked rubbish but actually, do you think the HOLAC stiched up Nadine Dorries? I think she is an idiot but...
I think Johnson and all who supported him were in the firing line from many directions. I note one senior Tory also implied yesterday that the civil service may have been putting the boot in too behind the scenes. They have far more influence than many realise and they really dislike unpredictable rule breakers like Johnson.

I think and hope that at long last the dislike of Johnson and his behaviours has reached the point where he will be unable to return to the Commons, however much the Tory right want him.
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jonathan.agnew

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Dec 27, 2018
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What title?

Lord Johnson of Sovereign Independence?

Baron Partygate?
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Well he did, in the words of a plumber I know "rip the tories another one". And if that doesn't deserve a place in the Lords, I don't know what does. Otoh I quite hope he returns to front-line politics (he shows real promise of ripping the tories several more ones).
 

jonathan.agnew

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The Privileges Committee have really scuppered that hope now. Their report ends any hope of him ever playing a part in public life again.

About time, after the immense damage he has done to this country.
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Intrinsically I hope you're right of course. But boris, like trump, isn't as much the problem as the 18 million cupid stunts that voted for him, that are very much still part of our public life. And I see farage has relaunched himself with an attack on parliamentary democracy (and invitation for boris to join him on youtube). In the teeth of a next more serious self inflicted recession. And we all know what happens when one mix economic pain with populism.
 
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Woosh

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I watched bbc qt last night. It was difficult to see Guto Harri mounting an attack on the privilege committee in defence of Johnson. He was an OK journalist before he started working for Johnson but his tactics are now really offensive. I reckon saneagle, our own public defender on here, will have a hard time finding anything good to say about this Guto Harri.
 
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flecc

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boris, like trump, isn't as much the problem as the 18 million cupid stunts that voted for him, that are very much still part of our public life.
True, but they have no ammunition while we have an overwhelming abundance of it.

There is nothing left that they can say in support of him. After his loss of the leadership and this devastating report, even the claim he can win elections doesn't ring true any more, now that he's a proven loser who failed in office, not once but twice.

Remember his Foreign Secretaryship? He ran away from that too by resigning, just as he has now from the Premiership. A coward, loser and liar to the end, will that do to be going on with?

As I've posted so many times, he's a sad apology for a human being. That has become too widely apparent for any recovery now. I'd put his chances as about equal to Jeremy Corbyn's now.
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Woosh

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JC has every chance to-be reelected in his current seat as an independent. Johnson doesn't.
 

jonathan.agnew

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Dec 27, 2018
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True, but they have no ammunition while we have an overwhelming abundance of it.

There is nothing left that they can say in support of him. After his loss of the leadership and this devastating report, even the claim he can win elections doesn't ring true any more, now that he's a proven loser who failed in office, not once but twice.

Remember his Foreign Secretaryship? He ran away from that too by resigning, just as he has now from the Premiership. A coward, loser and liar to the end, will that do to be going on with?

As I've posted so many times, he's a sad apology for a human being. That has become too widely apparent for any recovery now. I'd put his chances as about equal to Jeremy Corbyn's now.
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Again intrinsically I agree. But interviews with the citizens of Uxbridge in the news is ******* disturbing. Most think the piglet's been stitched up. It all feels a jamais vu of Cameron's confidence before the brexit vote. He assumed we live, culturally, in a Liberal democracy when nothing could be further from the truth.
 

flecc

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Oct 25, 2006
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interviews with the citizens of Uxbridge in the news is ******* disturbing. Most think the piglet's been stitched up.
Of course, they see it as an attack on themselves and there will be an element of supporting the underdog.

BUT:

They won't be selecting who stands for the Tories there.

Central Office will have something to say about who that is, which can take the form of "putting the boot in".

Also will those citizens enjoy the public ridicule if they do try to have Johnson?

And a reminder. When Johnson was first considered by the Uxbridge party, they sought a solemn promise from him that he would not be writing for the newspapers any more and would devote himself to the constituency.

He gave that solemn promise.

Three months later he was writing for The Spectator.
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