Brexit, for once some facts.

[oldgroaner]

Amusing headline in the Express
"
‘TERRIBLE result for PM!’ Jacob Rees-Mogg urges May to ‘see Queen urgently’ and RESIGN
THERESA May should “see the Queen urgently and resign”, according to Jacob Rees-Mogg, who believes the Prime Minister, despite winning a majority in the no confidence vote, has still suffered a “terrible result”.

How amusing: his attempt to "usurp the throne" was defeated nearly 2:1 and he declares at a terrible result for her?

He may look like an idiot
And talk like an idiot (sometimes in latin)
but don't let that fool you
The MP for the 18th Century
Really is an idiot!

With apologies to Groucho Marx

Who incidentally would utterly destroy any opposition from any of our present politicians had he the opportunity to debate with them!
Can you imagine?

 

[oldgroaner]

Something evil doth this way come...

Here you are , for collectors of Horror memorabilia the Rogues Gallery of the next would be PM

Seriously this lot look like a clear out sale of old monster props from Hammer House of Horror movie Studio

Vladimir must be laughing his head off at the return on his investment in the Leave Campaign!

 

[oldtom]

Something evil doth this way come...

My thoughts on seeing this collection of self-serving, millionaires and multi-millionaires went straight to the opinion I share with the father of the NHS:

'What is Toryism but organised spivvery? … No amount of cajolery can eradicate from my heart a deep burning hatred for the Tory Party … So far as I am concerned they are lower than vermin.'

People just like them existed in Bethlehem 2018 years ago, running the hotel and guest house racket, ripping off those poor people who were forced to travel to the town (no buses, no Uber) to register and they hadn't the humanity to find a room for a pregnant woman. The rest is history.

Nothing changes!

Tom

 

[oldtom]

Seriously this lot look like a clear out sale of old monster props from Horror House of Horror movie Studio

I used to wonder where the creators of 'The Adams Family' and 'The Munsters' got their ideas from. All is now clear.

Tom

 

[oldgroaner]

And in the Independent other news
"Brexit: Rolls-Royce moves design approval for engines from Derby to Germany amid uncertainty over EU divorce
Engine maker Rolls-Royce has confirmed it is pressing ahead with plans to shift design approval for large aero engines from Derby to Germany amid Brexit worries.
The group said it was in talks with the European Safety Aviation Agency over the move, which comes as part of Brexit contingency planning that has also seen it begin stockpiling parts in preparation.
But Rolls-Royce stressed the switch to Germany – where it already handles design approval for business jet engines – was a “precautionary and reversible technical action” and would not impact UK jobs.

Let us sincerely hope not!

 

[oldtom]

Based on recent events, these are my thoughts this morning:





…..and just a reminder of what 'Brexit' voters look like:



I missed this one yesterday but it sums up very well why May must be the worst British PM in history:



Tom

 

[oldgroaner]

What staggers the imagination is that anyone at all , anywhere , still clings to the notion that Brexit will be anything other than a disaster.
Even the theory of it is discredited, but even worse, as we are seeing on a daily basis the very structure of our democracy cannot handle even the simple act of leaving the EU in an orderly fashion .
As to the politicians ability to run a dynamic world leading trading and manufacturing nation, how can I illustrate the level of difficulty they will encounter?
I'll try
It's akin to a stone age group of Hunter Gatherers stumbling across a Jumbo 747 that has somehow travelled back in time without a crew, crash landed in a Jungle clearing, and the Hunter Gatherers climbing aboard , getting their heads together and deciding to fly down to warmer climes for a gap year break.

The old saying applies here
There are no such thing as problems, only opportunities,
But the number of opportunities is becoming a problem

 

[Fingers]

It's the lying Tom and Gromainer show this morning.

Is there anything more unedifying than an angry old man?

 

[Zlatan]

It's the lying Tom and Gromainer show this morning.

Is there anything more unedifying than an angry old man?

You, d think the pair of them were bored with trolling by now.

 

[tillson]

What staggers the imagination is that anyone at all , anywhere , still clings to the notion that Brexit will be anything other than a disaster.
Even the theory of it is discredited, but even worse, as we are seeing on a daily basis the very structure of our democracy cannot handle even the simple act of leaving the EU in an orderly fashion .
As to the politicians ability to run a dynamic world leading trading and manufacturing nation, how can I illustrate the level of difficulty they will encounter?
I'll try
It's akin to a stone age group of Hunter Gatherers stumbling across a Jumbo 747 that has somehow travelled back in time without a crew, crash landed in a Jungle clearing, and the Hunter Gatherers climbing aboard , getting their heads together and deciding to fly down to warmer climes for a gap year break.

The old saying applies here
There are no such thing as problems, only opportunities,
But the number of opportunities is becoming a problem

What staggers the imagination in equal magnitude is the fact that Theresa May celebrated the result of last night’s confidence vote. If she views the circumstances which brought about the vote and only narrowly scraping through after promising to quit, as a success worthy of celebration, I suppose it goes some towards explaining why she thinks her Brexit deal is worth pursuing.

I think the Conservatives screwed up last night. I don’t think she has any intention of voluntarily quitting.

 

[Fingers]

You, d think the pair of them were bored with trolling by now.

This is literally their life.

One of them genuinely thinks by posting on a random message board his sage words are published to millions who actively tune in to read him.

He genuinely thought that.

The other is simply a liar.

Great tag team.

 

[Kudoscycles]

Everyday, the hypocrisy and stupidity of the hardline Brexiteers grows.

They've weakened us at every turn - triggered A50 too early without a plan, formed splinter groups to undermine the government's negotiating position, and now they've attempted a mutiny that's failed and made us look even weaker.

Either Brexiteers are traitorous cowards or incompetent fools - both disastrous for the UK.

If they were in Russia or China they would have been sent to Mongolia or Siberia for 'retraining',here we have to put up with the idiots.
What are they trying to achieve? Bring back foxhunting?....You can see fat slobs like Cash and Bone dusting off the hunting pink,riding over a cliff,Tally-Ho old chap!!!!!
KudosDave

 

[oldgroaner]

It's the lying Tom and Gromainer show this morning.

Is there anything more unedifying than an angry old man?

Angry? Actually disappointed is closer, we should have been able to expect younger people not to be so gullible as unfortunately many like yourself appear to be, imagining that the political incompetents you support can make brexit work

 

[Zlatan]

Angry? Actually disappointed is closer, we should have been able to expect younger people not to be so gullible as unfortunately many like yourself appear to be, imagining that the political incompetents you support can make brexit work

That's odd OG, not long ago it was the older generation taking blame for Brexit..according to you that is..
Its always the very people to claim not to suffer from any prejudice or discriminatory thoughts are the very same who have to compartmentalise folk into groups. Perhaps it's easier for their limited abilities to cope labeling groups than dealing with reality. The world is just too complex for some... Like Tom failing to explain how he can be a so called socialist Corbyn supporter yet insult leavers...
Or how OG can never explain the irony in his labelling Brexit for the rich, tax havens etc and fact many socialists do support Brexit.. Its easier to dismiss all that and just put down or insult leavers, trying to lay blame on others... When actually much of the division, argument and stalled negotiations has been caused by remoaners.Typified by OG and Tom on here.

 

[Kudoscycles]

Interesting strategy ......

What will the Labour party do now? Can it force the situation?
It would be intriguing if Labour were to call a vote of no confidence in May’s government, given the scale of the rebellion on Wednesday night. If hard Brexiters really want a change of leadership, they could, in theory, side with Labour, although in practice that would be a major step for a Tory MP to take.
Under the Fixed Term Parliament Act, that would not immediately force a general election, but rather open a 14-day window for somebody else, almost certainly another Tory leader, to form a new government, which would need to be confirmed by a further vote of confidence.
That alone, might give Labour strategists pause – but the party leadership is also holding back because, if it does not succeed, defeat in a vote of no confidence could play into the hands of second referendum campaigners.
Those calling for a second vote want Labour to conclude that it cannot force a general election – in line with its carefully crafted Brexit policy – and should move on to campaigning for another referendum instead.
But Jeremy Corbyn has always been lukewarm on the idea and there is huge suspicion over the subject among those close to the leader, because many of those keenest on a second referendum in the party have been among his biggest critics in the past.
Labour may act in calling for a vote of no confidence, but it would be a surprise if it did so before Christmas. The party line is that it wants to see May definitively fail in the Brexit talks first and that is more likely to take place in the new year.

KudosDave

 

[Woosh]

I think the Conservatives screwed up last night. I don’t think she has any intention of voluntarily quitting.

117 backbenchers (to give JRM maximum leeway on his reckoning) out of 175 voted against May - two third, in normal time, TM's cabinet would have told her that the game is up but this is not normal time, if you take away the single reason for the vote, TM's brexit deal, that's about the same percentage as the opposition to her deal among conservative voters. If you remove that factor, then her approval is pretty unanimous among tory MPs who agree with her deal.
Therefore she did do a lot better than MT who got ousted on a similar vote.

 

[oldgroaner]

This is literally their life.

One of them genuinely thinks by posting on a random message board his sage words are published to millions who actively tune in to read him.

He genuinely thought that.

The other is simply a liar.

Great tag team.

You really should leave sarcasm alone when you can't even advance a single argument that makes brexit look anything other than foolish, for someone who claims our debate is futile, why do you come on here just to stir up trouble and try to disrupt it?
Because that's what leave supporters are down to with no useful argument they can present.
And by the way After I asserted that a Million hits suggested that a lot of non posting people read the forum, you came up not only with this bogus statement
"
One of them genuinely thinks by posting on a random message board his sage words are published to millions who actively tune in to read him.,

You then had to put your foot further into the proverbial by trying to prove using somewhat crude calculation that 30 individuals were each viewing the forum fifty times a day for two years.

And even after that crass stupidity you raise the matter again as if your earlier embarrassment was a victory?
Are you hoping that unlike you I suffer from memory loss?

No wonder you work in propaganda, you have a very odd talent for believing any nonsense, even the poor quality that originates from you.

 

[Fingers]

117 backbenchers (to give JRM maximum leeway on his reckoning) out of 175 voted against May - two third, in normal time, TM's cabinet would have told her that the game is up but this is not normal time, if you take away the single reason for the vote, TM's brexit deal, that's about the same percentage as the opposition to her deal among conservative voters. If you remove that factor, then her approval is pretty unanimous among tory MPs who agree with her deal.
Therefore she did do a lot better than MT who got ousted on a similar vote.

It's still a staggering amount of Tory MPs that voted against a sitting PM.

I am amazed she is still going. She really is a zombie.

 

[Woosh]

Labour may act in calling for a vote of no confidence, but it would be a surprise if it did so before Christmas. The party line is that it wants to see May definitively fail in the Brexit talks first and that is more likely to take place in the new year.

JC is right not to rush in to call a vote of no confidence. With colleagues like the ERG, TM won't last long.
Let's just fast forward to end of January. The HoC cannot agree with TM's deal.
Her next move is plan B: give to the HoC brexit committee the task to extend A50 and negotiate the deal.
JC will be seen as the hero of the day.

 

[Fingers]

You really should leave sarcasm alone when you can't even advance a single argument that makes brexit look anything other than foolish, for someone who claims our debate is futile, why do you come on here just to stir up trouble and try to disrupt it?
Because that's what leave supporters are down to with no useful argument they can present.

That argument is done. We won. It's now the implementation we need to hammer out.