Brexit, for once some facts.

[Fingers]

I like the cut of your Gib.

It’s the beginning of the split.

Was always going to happen. France will demand some sort of border control soon. Portugal will want special dispensation for our tourists. Ireland will buckle when they realise a no deal will bankrupt them.

Clocks ticking though.

 

[oldtom]

Those changed our country fundamentally and were just forced on us.

We had the same voting rights as all the other member states so we didn't perhaps get our way - how do you equate that with having something forced upon us? Is there some other democratic system you'd prefer?

Tom

 

[Danidl]

Maastricht Lisbon. Those changed our country fundamentally and were just forced on us. Gordon Brown and Slimy Blair said they would give us a vote on it but reneged . Brown ended up sneaking in the back door to sign it. To me it just shows a total contempt for the people of this country

I can accept a politician decieving the public,it happens but for people in a democracy to vote that politican back into power.. whose fault is that. ?.

 

[flecc]

I made a light hearted joke about a page number. You replied about incidents that happened in that year. It has precisely nothing to do with Brexit.

I made no mention of any incidents in the year 1944. My reply was everything to do about Brexit, the negotiation stages in the context of your post.

You are obviously desperately trying to find an opposing answer to my pointing out that Remainers had it right all along about the exit deal and Leavers have been proved wrong.

Let it go, there is no answer. The exit deal is final now and cannot be altered.
.

 

[oldtom]

It’s the beginning of the split.

Was always going to happen. France will demand some sort of border control soon. Portugal will want special dispensation for our tourists. Ireland will buckle when they realise a no deal will bankrupt them.

Clocks ticking though.

Tom

 

[Fingers]

Tom the Liar

 

[Fingers]

I made no mention of any incidents in the year 1944. My reply was everything to do about Brexit, the negotiation stages in the context of your post.

You are obviously desperately trying to find an opposing answer to my pointing out that Remainers had it right all along about the exit deal and Leavers have been proved wrong.

Let it go, there is no answer. The exit deal is final now and cannot be altered.
.

Dude.....


fleccMember
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We're on page 1944.

The tide my friends is turning in this Nations favour.
1944.



That tide was only turning due to our being rescued by Russia and the USA.
This time no-one is coming to the rescue. After losing the first two battles, negotiating format and departure deal, we either concede the third and final forthcoming battle of the trade negotiations to the EU or lose the war.
.

#38884flecc, Today at 9:24 PM

 

[flecc]

Maastricht Lisbon. Those changed our country fundamentally and were just forced on us. Gordon Brown and Slimy Blair said they would give us a vote on it but reneged . Brown ended up sneaking in the back door to sign it. To me it just shows a total contempt for the people of this country

Indeed those treaties radically changed our status. However, we are a parliamentary democracy so Blair and Brown had no more right to offer a vote on the issue than Cameron had to offer a referendum. The two show how divisive such attempts can be, whether offered to the public or not.

General elections are where the public should express their wishes.
.

 

[Danidl]

It’s the beginning of the split.

Was always going to happen. France will demand some sort of border control soon. Portugal will want special dispensation for our tourists. Ireland will buckle when they realise a no deal will bankrupt them.

Clocks ticking though.

Sorry fingers , Ireland will not buckle,not under those terms. You do not understand us at all if that is what you think. Bankrupt... we have been there and back.
bad behaviour of a fraction in the British media has soured our response. I won't bother listing them,but the amount of ignorance displayed by those who may, and should know better would be breathtaking,except we have heard it before. It was ugly at the time of the referendum, and then re-emerged when they realised that we were not an outer Hebrides island.

. In the event of a UK crash out ,we will be badly hurt financially, no question, but probably less than our compatriots, your fellow citizens in NI or our fellow celts in Wales. I would expect to see a sympathetic response from French and German shoppers for Irish Beef, butter and farmed salmon. The French might even develop a liking for cheddar,.
Yes extra border controls may go up in France .
I would not assume that Portugal will be making special efforts, indeed if the pound drops below the euro, as it very well may, there won't be many arriving. ..

 

[flecc]

Dude.....


fleccMember
Joined:
Oct 25, 2006
Messages:
39,844
Likes Received:
6,940
↑
We're on page 1944.

The tide my friends is turning in this Nations favour.
1944.



That tide was only turning due to our being rescued by Russia and the USA.
This time no-one is coming to the rescue. After losing the first two battles, negotiating format and departure deal, we either concede the third and final forthcoming battle of the trade negotiations to the EU or lose the war.
.

#38884flecc, Today at 9:24 PM

And still you don't understand. The first brief sentence about Russia and the USA joining into WW2 (long before 1944) showed I understood the general context you posted in, that's all. I expected you to be smart enough to understand that.

The rest was only about the three stages of Brexit negotiation in a similar vein. Nowhere did I mention any incidents from 1944 as you accused me of doing.

Stop trying to twist what I posted into a version of your own.
.

 

[Fingers]

Sorry fingers , Ireland will not buckle,not under those terms. You do not understand us at all if that is what you think. Bankrupt... we have been there and back.
bad behaviour of a fraction in the British media has soured our response. I won't bother listing them,but the amount of ignorance displayed by those who may, and should know better would be breathtaking,except we have heard it before. It was ugly at the time of the referendum, and then re-emerged when they realised that we were not an outer Hebrides island.

. In the event of a UK crash out ,we will be badly hurt financially, no question, but probably less than our compatriots, your fellow citizens in NI or our fellow celts in Wales. I would expect to see a sympathetic response from French and German shoppers for Irish Beef, butter and farmed salmon. The French might even develop a liking for cheddar,.
Yes extra border controls may go up in France .
I would not assume that Portugal will be making special efforts, indeed if the pound drops below the euro, as it very well may, there won't be many arriving. ..

It won’t come to that of course. Because of the implication.

 

[Danidl]

For what it is worth, I don't think that Spain can veto over Gibraltar. That is what qualified majority means.

 

[oldgroaner]

Maastricht Lisbon. Those changed our country fundamentally and were just forced on us. Gordon Brown and Slimy Blair said they would give us a vote on it but reneged . Brown ended up sneaking in the back door to sign it. To me it just shows a total contempt for the people of this country

Actually it doesn't show that does it? this is a Parliamentary Democracy where Parliament is Sovereign and the Voters surrender all power to it by casting their votes, and once you have voted for a political party, they are legally free to do not only whatever was in their manifesto, but in reality, anything else they fancy.

 

[oldgroaner]

It’s the beginning of the split.

Was always going to happen. France will demand some sort of border control soon. Portugal will want special dispensation for our tourists. Ireland will buckle when they realise a no deal will bankrupt them.

Clocks ticking though.

Dreaming won't change anything, but your flights of fancy do help to prove to the many people who watch the thread that the leave campaign has reached the point of being helpless against the flow of events that have left it behind

All it's supporters can do is complain, caper around like jesters making juvenile jokes in an attempt to derail the debate with pointless and progressively wilder claims that they have been "stabbed in the back " by their own side
Even wilder are the claims of the EU being afraid of what was agreed and riven with dissent and fear of the consequences of the chequers agreement

Wishful thinking is all that Brexit has going for it, nothing else.

Where's your big plan now?
More attempts to joke your way out?

 

[oldgroaner]

In the Telegraph this morning
Brexit rebels admit attempts to unseat Theresa May have stalled as Eurosceptic MPs turn on each other

• PM faces down her critics as no-confidence target missed

Hardly surprising, Rats don't usually co-operate, neither do dogs, you need Wolves to do that, and the Brexit rebels struggle to be classified as vermin

 

[oldgroaner]

In the Express
MP warns 'bullying' EU to RESPECT UK or face consequences – 'What message does it send'
CONSERVATIVE MP Andrew Mitchell warned Brussels to "respect" the UK as MPs prepare to vote on Theresa May's Brexit deal - claiming EU negotiators would send the wrong message to other eurosceptic member states if they refused the UK more time to negotiate.

This is pathetic now this fool is "Warning" the EU? and he couldn't be more wrong about the message the EU would give to non existent Eurosceptic states
Being firm with us is the very message the EU wants them to understand.

 

[Woosh]

In the Express
MP warns 'bullying' EU to RESPECT UK or face consequences – 'What message does it send'
CONSERVATIVE MP Andrew Mitchell warned Brussels to "respect" the UK as MPs prepare to vote on Theresa May's Brexit deal - claiming EU negotiators would send the wrong message to other eurosceptic member states if they refused the UK more time to negotiate.

This is pathetic now this fool is "Warning" the EU? and he couldn't be more wrong about the message the EU would give to non existent Eurosceptic states
Being firm with us is the very message the EU wants them to understand.

what is he going to do? jump off a cliff to prove his point?
all he does is to show would be leaver members of the EU how not to leave.

 

[oldgroaner]

This is what the leave vote brings
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2012/aug/22/britannia-unchained-rise-of-new-tory-right
The words of Dominic Raab in Parliament
"
current employment law offers "excessive protections" to workers. "People who are coasting – it should be easier to let them go, to give the unemployed a chance. It is a delicate balancing act, but it should be decided in favour of the latter."

I worked in a company that did that before the law prevented it, where a word out of place could cost you your job, is that the sort of Brexit people knew they were voting for?

 

[oyster]

Sometimes looks like Polly was made for now:

For hard-right revolutionaries, Brexit is cover for a different end

Polly Toynbee
A group of extremists within the Tory party would welcome the havoc unleashed by ‘no deal’ to advance their cause

The vultures circle a wounded prime minister, who is attacked by the hordes of extremists in her party while beset by new inconvenient facts daily exposing the damage Brexit can do. Look, the British army is preparing for the worst: emergency troops are at the ready. Operation Temperer, which usually provides soldiers for terrorist attacks, is now ordered to make 10,000 soldiers available to keep order on the streets and in shops, and to distribute emergency medicines in case of a no-deal crash-out.

“Our firms are spending hundreds of millions of pounds preparing for the worst case – and not one penny of it will create new jobs or new products,” warns the Confederation of British Industry chief, Carolyn Fairbairn.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/nov/20/hard-right-brexit-tory-revolution-no-deal-eu

 

[daveboy]

View attachment 27766

Tom