Brexit, for once some facts.

[Kudoscycles]

The EU is probably skint,not surprising when you think that only 4 pay in and 24 receive. We should now walk away from these talks and let the EU make the next move,they dont want us doing free trade deals with Asia and no mechanism for 'dumping' cheap product into the EU.
What they want is money,they are desperate for the £100 billion,but there is no way May is going to give any more than our normal contribution and that is only for a limited time.
They would give us everything we want if we gave them £100 billion,but politically and financially we are not going to do so....so impasse !!!!!
Now Corbyn would he give it to them????
KudosDave

 

[Danidl]

There I was, thinking that under EU rules Chedder cheese could only be made in Chedder.

Let me add to that having read this http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/republic-of-ireland/irish-cheddar-cheese-amongst-brexits-first-victims-35610371.html

Good reason to get behind the UK with its negotiations?

He said 60pc of Irish Cheddar exports currently go to the UK.

"Nobody else eats Cheddar. It can't be diverted off to France," he warned.

. Or yet another reason for the UK to abandon Brexit?

I could say hard cheese, but ...
The UK apparently produces 250,000 tones of the stuff per year so the Irish contribution of 77,000 tons to that consumption .. is about 25% of the ploughman's lunches or little slivers served on flights, not negligible!

There are apparently emerging markets in Germany, where the notion of open air grass fed animals 365 days per year has appeal, but certainly the potential loss of 60% of a market is sobering.
There is a specific sub category of cheddar which is EU domain protected for Somerset, so you are correct, but the generic name is allowed

 

[Danidl]

The EU is probably skint,not surprising when you think that only 4 pay in and 24 receive. We should now walk away from these talks and let the EU make the next move,they dont want us doing free trade deals with Asia and no mechanism for 'dumping' cheap product into the EU.
What they want is money,they are desperate for the £100 billion,but there is no way May is going to give any more than our normal contribution and that is only for a limited time.
They would give us everything we want if we gave them £100 billion,but politically and financially we are not going to do so....so impasse !!!!!
Now Corbyn would he give it to them????
KudosDave

What the EU wish for is that the UK remain, not for the money but for the social cohesion. The EU will continue, will not flourish as well as if the UK were a fully committed member, and I don't mean just in financial terms. With the UK outside, there will be a need for boarder protection, etc which was otherwise unnecessary. The EU in general will feel pain, Ireland will be hurt more and the UK almost certainly the most wounded.
Ireland will suffer in a number of ways, one of which is that our law system is modelled on the common law of England, modified by the lessons learned by the American consitution, whereas the majority of Europe has had a Napoleonic influence.

 

[Woosh]

The EU in general will feel pain, Ireland will be hurt more and the UK almost certainly the most wounded.

At the moment, the EU thinks that it holds all the cards.
That's true as long as the UK has not prepared for a no deal outcome.
If the UK spend say £10 billions preparing for WTO brexit, the EU will have to start talking trade soon.
That's practically the only subject where the two sides will want to agree first.

 

[Kudoscycles]

What the EU wish for is that the UK remain, not for the money but for the social cohesion. The EU will continue, will not flourish as well as if the UK were a fully committed member, and I don't mean just in financial terms. With the UK outside, there will be a need for boarder protection, etc which was otherwise unnecessary. The EU in general will feel pain, Ireland will be hurt more and the UK almost certainly the most wounded.
Ireland will suffer in a number of ways, one of which is that our law system is modelled on the common law of England, modified by the lessons learned by the American consitution, whereas the majority of Europe has had a Napoleonic influence.

Agree with that except I think Ireland will be the most hurt,especially if the EU force Ireland to build a hard border,which the EU dont have a choice,unless they want a 300 mile long smuggling route.
KudosDave

 

[anotherkiwi]

Agree with that except I think Ireland will be the most hurt,especially if the EU force Ireland to build a hard border,which the EU dont have a choice,unless they want a 300 mile long smuggling route.
KudosDave

I know this guy who is truly amazing at building walls, great walls, beautiful walls, and he will make Ireland pay for that wall...

 

[oldgroaner]

are you still blaming people who voted for their choice?

after Brexit that will take on Pandemic proportions!

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

I love a good graph... hand here are 7 from the FT to show the impact of Brexit.

https://www.ft.com/content/0260242c-370b-11e6-9a05-82a9b15a8ee7

 

[oldgroaner]

At the moment, the EU thinks that it holds all the cards.
That's true as long as the UK has not prepared for a no deal outcome.
If the UK spend say £10 billions preparing for WTO brexit, the EU will have to start talking trade soon.
That's practically the only subject where the two sides will want to agree first.

How are we supposed to prepare for a "No Deal" outcome?
With neither the means, expertise or interest to make this nation work in a way that keeps the population passive and happy?
Any ideas?

 

[Woosh]

Any ideas?

it's going to be difficult.
we need to protect as much as possible all the goodwill of the EU immigrants, so that they don't leave the UK. We need to re-assure investors that we are working on a trade deal with the EU as priority, but at the same time, we need to charge EU imports as much duty as it's legally possible. The more they pay, the more motivated they will be to negotiate.
We need to demonstrate that we are open to trade, especially with the Pacific rim countries. We open the doors to high tech Korean and Japanese companies. They will provide us with a counterweight against the German and French industries.

 

[oldgroaner]

I love a good graph... hand here are 7 from the FT to show the impact of Brexit.

https://www.ft.com/content/0260242c-370b-11e6-9a05-82a9b15a8ee7

Every day in every way Brexit looks worse , and worse and worse.

No Foreign Power could do more damage to the Nation than the very people charged with governing it responsibly, short of raining Nuclear Weapons down on our heads.

"England that was wont to Conquer others
Hath Made a Conquest of itself"

John of Gaunt

 

[oldgroaner]

it's going to be difficult.
we need to protect as much as possible all the goodwill of the EU immigrants, so that they don't leave the UK. We need to re-assure investors that we are working on a trade deal with the EU as priority, but at the same time, we need to charge EU imports as much duty as it's legally possible. The more they pay, the more motivated they will be to negotiate.
We need to demonstrate that we are open to trade, especially with the Pacific rim countries. We open the doors to high tech Korean and Japanese companies. They will provide us with a counterweight against the German and French industries.

In other words you have no faith in the notion that we are capable of being an independent manufacturing nation.
No surprise, I don't think so either, so we will have to rely on foreigners exploiting our workforce, infrastructure and resources, in other words be OWNED by others.
What a fate for a Nation that was once the workshop of the world, now living on Scraps at someone elses table.
Taking back control? no simply being sold to someone else because we can't run our own country, and make a success of it.
Sick man of Europe before we joined the common market, and the circle is completed with Brexit. to Sick Man outside Europe

 

[Woosh]

Sick Man outside Europe

that may be the price worth paying to some.

 

[flecc]

"Nobody else eats Cheddar. It can't be diverted off to France," he warned.

This is nonsense, the French now have a taste for cheddar cheese and some of our companies now have a large market for it there.

As this link shows, as far back as 2012 the market was developing rapidly.
.

 

[Kudoscycles]

The governments white paper released today on a 'no-deal' scenario started to give an insight into the customs problems of no deal.
I found a schedule of the tariffs in both directions,these don't include anti dumping duties. The highest tariffs are foodstuff....meat ,fish,vegetables,fruit and processed food are all 30% plus,that should mean that we will have an incentive to grow at home,except we have made it plain that we don't any longer welcome EU farm workers.
Unless we can crack deals elsewhere from the EU our food will inevitably be delayed and be more expensive.
Our farmers are going to find it difficult to sell into the EU,this is particularly critical for Ireland,where agriculture is important in both directions and many processors are across the border.
Still Brexiters accept this for the 'advantages' of Brexit.
Under WTO rules,unless we have a trade agreement we are committed to creating a level field for all tariffs,so we do not have open flexibility as to what level we set our import tariffs.
The EU will definitely put anti-dumping duties on us to stop us dumping cheap Asian product into Europe.
KudosDave

 

[Danidl]

This is nonsense, the French now have a taste for cheddar cheese and some of our companies now have a large market for it there.

As this link shows, as far back as 2012 the market was developing rapidly.
.

In fairness he was quoting an Irish government official for food exports at a trade conference seeking to galvanize ,irish food companies into action. There is a minority interest in France for food exotica, and cheddar in France fits into that category. If you recognise the names of the French shops , they would be likely in the more affluent areas , not the local or mass market
After about fives weeks away, I find I miss the taste of a sharp cheddar.
Even were the market to grow, it's from such a small base that finding a home for 70,000 tons is a big ask.
Compared to what I have picked up we Irish are much more aware of the consequences of Brexit than even the UK, which appears in denial.

 

[anotherkiwi]

it's going to be difficult.
we need to protect as much as possible all the goodwill of the EU immigrants, so that they don't leave the UK. We need to re-assure investors that we are working on a trade deal with the EU as priority, but at the same time, we need to charge EU imports as much duty as it's legally possible. The more they pay, the more motivated they will be to negotiate.
We need to demonstrate that we are open to trade, especially with the Pacific rim countries. We open the doors to high tech Korean and Japanese companies. They will provide us with a counterweight against the German and French industries.

Open the doors quickly and profit while you can because Trump has decided to wipe Korea and Japan off the face of the earth. He wants his name in the history books and the easy way is nuclear war in North Korea. Unfortunately that also takes out Japan and South Korea as unfortunate colateral damage...

 

[oldgroaner]

Released to pleased the usual Gullible readers in the Mail this morning
"
Huge inland lorry parks and NO import taxes: Bullish May draws plan for ‘no deal’ and prepares to spend billions on new border controls to keep British trade flowing if Brussels talks fail

Imagine the additional expense delay and extra pollution involves and the increase in Administration costs.
And for what advantage?
The EU negotiators must be fed up of our ridiculous posturing and THEY will walk away, not us.

 

[Woosh]

And for what advantage?

to collect import duty from goods originated in the EU.
There is current agreement between the EU27 to make the UK pay the divorce bill but not a pip on how future trade will be conducted. That's why there seems to be a broad similarity between the EU and hard brexiters.
Once the EU27 work out how they want to trade with the UK after brexit, it will become clear that a trade agreement must precede the solution to the NI border and citizens rights,

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

we need to charge EU imports as much duty as it's legally possible.

hate to break it to you. But if we slap duty on imports from the EU, this doesn't cost the EU company anything. The import duty is paid by the UK importer, and will be added to their costs which will be passed directly to customers. It isn't charged to the EU companies at all.

The only possible negative for the EU companies is if the duty puts UK customers off buying EU brands. However I don't think even a 20% increase would do that... all it will do is cost UK customers more for the products they want.

So who's being punished??