Oldtom may put you in his dislike list for criticizing Mr Corbyn.
Brexit, for once some facts.
- Thread starter flecc
- Start date
I agree that we don't need to know every detail but I can't see why we can't have a free vote in parliament on the end deal that May ends up with.
I think we are all agreed that we can't trust May and Co to get us a good deal so why shouldn't we have the opportunity to reject that deal.
The government seem to be planning that we will come out with no deal ,then on WTO terms. Actually I have had a glance at WTO and maybe that won't be so bad,as long as you are not poor...food will average out at 14% tariff,that will only affect the poor and allow our farmers to earn more,general tariff will be about 4% above the average from China,cars and car parts about 10% ....that will kill off exports of cars from UK to EU,Sunderland and Swindon would suffer,but elsewhere should be ok.....if she brings down corporation tax to 15% to keep the big businesses,Hammond is determined to keep benefits down,Davis says
we will put immigrants on 5 year visas,cheap labour will be maintained,prices will rise....yep,it looks like a good deal for the rich and a bad deal for the poor,but wasn't that what Brexiters voted for?
KudosDave
We've not seen the final deal yet.
She has to make the right noises about being prepared to walk away. Let's wait & see what happens.
I'm very disappointed with Corbyn, unless he knows something we don't and is playing a clever game.
The snag is that we have a group of idiots running the show that would be better employed of you gave them a mop and bucket and told them to clean the toilets, rather than negotiate the future of the country .
Like you 'tillson', I am disappointed by Corbyn's position on this issue. A lack of clarity about the direction of this 'Brexit' foolhardiness is not the mark of political party leader. Don't get me wrong; I love the chap's principles and his desire to transform British society into a more equitable place for all citizens but this Labour Party shambles in regard to 'Brexit' presents the government with an opportunity to railroad a deal, any deal, through parliament without any real checks and balances.
As Dave Elderfield has described, to allow the UK negotiators to simply retire from the 'Brexit' negotiations on completion, (or prematurely!) without permitting a parliamentary vote on the outcome is simply madness and subverts democracy in the most dictatorial way.
It is one thing to watch the leader of the opposition acquiesce with the PM's determination to invoke A50, even though she has to all intents and purposes proclaimed that 'Brexit' is a fait accompli, whatever the result. It is quite another, having taken the line that the democratic will of the people is being followed, to refuse to challenge the government in order that the people's democratic representatives can enact that democratic principle at the most crucial stage.
If any deal will do, even a bad deal or no deal at all, why bother with the charade of sitting down to negotiate? Of course, if that is an over-simplication and we are not prepared to just accept anything and will not agree to anything that smacks of a punishment from the EU, then I would contend that there has to be a free vote in parliament on whatever the PM believes to be the way forward.
My real difficulty, should this go as badly as I believe it will long-term, is that all the racists, all the fascist groups and all the thickos who voted 'out' will never have a 'road to Damascus' conversion until it is too late but they will have one! Those people, as has been stated many times, did not vote to make themselves and their families poorer. Neither did they vote for 'taking back control' which will not prevent foreigners coming to the UK. They already know if they voted on account of the NHS being funded from our EU membership savings that that is never going to happen. When carmaking ceases in the UK and those laid off discover that there is no other work, there will be riots not from the 'pro-remain' lobby, but from the nouveau-poor, created as a direct consequence of 'Brexit'.
Of course, it could be that those groups will be perfectly happy as any price is worth paying just to get our sovereignty back.......that sovereignty that we never lost, you remember the one! Somehow though, I don't think they will be happy and neither will anyone else outside of the rich elite, a very small percentage of the population.
Tom
The Voters chose what they thought was a revolution against the Government, and what did they gain?
A Government that is Revolting.
What's not to like? with luck this will be the final nail in the coffin of Right wing rule given a little patience.
The best hope for this country will be to watch the Peter Sellers film "The Mouse that Roared" and emulate the Duchy of Grand Fenwick in the film
What the Tory Government is attempting to do makes this Satirical Film look like a Serious Documentary!
A Government that is Revolting.
What's not to like? with luck this will be the final nail in the coffin of Right wing rule given a little patience.
The best hope for this country will be to watch the Peter Sellers film "The Mouse that Roared" and emulate the Duchy of Grand Fenwick in the film
What the Tory Government is attempting to do makes this Satirical Film look like a Serious Documentary!
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From the Telegraph
"
Theresa May travel plans left on a train in 'serious security breach'
Sensitive documents setting out Theresa May's travel plans were left on a train in a blunder branded a "serious security breach".
Downing Street has launched an investigation after the details of the Prime Minister's schedule were found by a passenger.
As well as setting out transport arrangements for a visit to the North West, the papers included the address of a hotel Mrs May was booked in to work from during the afternoon.
These papers give a detailed -assessment of her movements. Had such information reached potential terrorists it could serve to confirm their plansInspector Ken Wharfe, former royal bodyguard
They also outlined plans for a call to Nato Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg as well as arrangements for a "treasurers' dinner" in Altrincham.
The documents, discovered in the first class train carriage of a train heading for Edinburgh on the day of the visit, were handed to The Daily Mirror.
Former royal bodyguard Inspector Ken Wharfe told the newspaper that leaving travel documents on a train was "inexcusable" and a "serious security breach".
Another example of "Taking back control" interesting that the person finding the documents handed them in to the Daily Mirror, perhaps he said
"с удовольствием " and laughed?
"
Theresa May travel plans left on a train in 'serious security breach'
Sensitive documents setting out Theresa May's travel plans were left on a train in a blunder branded a "serious security breach".
Downing Street has launched an investigation after the details of the Prime Minister's schedule were found by a passenger.
As well as setting out transport arrangements for a visit to the North West, the papers included the address of a hotel Mrs May was booked in to work from during the afternoon.
These papers give a detailed -assessment of her movements. Had such information reached potential terrorists it could serve to confirm their plansInspector Ken Wharfe, former royal bodyguard
They also outlined plans for a call to Nato Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg as well as arrangements for a "treasurers' dinner" in Altrincham.
The documents, discovered in the first class train carriage of a train heading for Edinburgh on the day of the visit, were handed to The Daily Mirror.
Former royal bodyguard Inspector Ken Wharfe told the newspaper that leaving travel documents on a train was "inexcusable" and a "serious security breach".
Another example of "Taking back control" interesting that the person finding the documents handed them in to the Daily Mirror, perhaps he said
"с удовольствием " and laughed?
'The Poke' gives us this today:
http://www.thepoke.co.uk/2017/03/13/tory-mp-denies-sending-controversial-tweet-sat-front-giant-picture/
So, if anyone has ever disagreed with anything I have said......in the history of the world; if anything I have written has annoyed anyone or upset anyone........well, it wasn't me - I never wrote it/the site owners have stitched me up/I have been misquoted/There are forces at work here you know nothing of/David Icke's a mate of mine/ you are taking it out of context/I was only kidding.
Dr Liam Fox is my idol and I try to live up to his standards and I now rest my case your honour!
Tom
http://www.thepoke.co.uk/2017/03/13/tory-mp-denies-sending-controversial-tweet-sat-front-giant-picture/
So, if anyone has ever disagreed with anything I have said......in the history of the world; if anything I have written has annoyed anyone or upset anyone........well, it wasn't me - I never wrote it/the site owners have stitched me up/I have been misquoted/There are forces at work here you know nothing of/David Icke's a mate of mine/ you are taking it out of context/I was only kidding.
Dr Liam Fox is my idol and I try to live up to his standards and I now rest my case your honour!
Tom
Now it's official!
'News Thump' reveals what most of us already knew:
http://newsthump.com/2017/03/10/katie-hopkins-now-officially-full-of-****/
The same organ's editorial view, (well, almost!) provides this advice from Hopkins' legal team:
http://newsthump.com/2017/03/10/katie-hopkins-lawyers-advise-that-any-future-lies-should-only-be-written-on-a-bus/
I really find it incredible that this woman hasn't found a safe tory seat somewhere in the country - she has all the talents required to get right to the top in the Conservative Party, oh yes!
Tom
'News Thump' reveals what most of us already knew:
http://newsthump.com/2017/03/10/katie-hopkins-now-officially-full-of-****/
The same organ's editorial view, (well, almost!) provides this advice from Hopkins' legal team:
http://newsthump.com/2017/03/10/katie-hopkins-lawyers-advise-that-any-future-lies-should-only-be-written-on-a-bus/
I really find it incredible that this woman hasn't found a safe tory seat somewhere in the country - she has all the talents required to get right to the top in the Conservative Party, oh yes!
Tom
You know, the more I read of this wonderful, serious news organ, the more I like it. They have covered the recent news that other major news organs just will not print, like this piece about the 'Daily Mail'...........
http://newsthump.com/2017/03/03/daily-mail-issues-apology-to-readers-after-front-page-fails-to-mention-immigrants-cancer-or-sex/
Tom
http://newsthump.com/2017/03/03/daily-mail-issues-apology-to-readers-after-front-page-fails-to-mention-immigrants-cancer-or-sex/
Tom
And finally, particularly for a certain poster whose name escapes me at this moment, 'New Thump' has uncovered the reason why Jeremy Corbyn, who shares his initials with another reluctant hero from the Bible, has failed to really get to grips with his job as leader of the opposition......
http://newsthump.com/2017/03/06/jeremy-corbyn-didnt-declare-the-salary-for-leader-of-the-opposition-because-he-didnt-know-it-was-him/
So there you have it - perfectly understandable; the kind of oversight anyone could make.......unlike leaving government papers on a train!
Tom
http://newsthump.com/2017/03/06/jeremy-corbyn-didnt-declare-the-salary-for-leader-of-the-opposition-because-he-didnt-know-it-was-him/
So there you have it - perfectly understandable; the kind of oversight anyone could make.......unlike leaving government papers on a train!
Tom
I remember an article that she wrote about the Parent & Child reserved car parking spaces you find close to the entrance door at supermarkets. She was proposing that these spaces should be re-located at the furthest extremity of the car park in order to make the podgy parent walk some of the flab off. Can't really argue with that.
I must have missed this one earlier. It's an appeal for crowdfunding and I'm sure many readers here will give it due consideration in just the same way as one would for a good cause.
http://newsthump.com/2017/03/12/gofundme-campaign-to-pay-katie-hopkins-legal-bills-holding-steady-at-eighty-pence/
Tom
http://newsthump.com/2017/03/12/gofundme-campaign-to-pay-katie-hopkins-legal-bills-holding-steady-at-eighty-pence/
Tom
This part is effectively nonsense. As long as the EU has a reason to set a standard which isn't discriminatory, they can set whatever standards they wish. There are many existing examples as proof.
And within the EU many countries set their own standards which can incidentally discriminate as a by product. For example, more than half of all EU countries ban the production of GM foods, which discriminates against many, including the USA and it's GM provider companies.
.
You've linked to something that we have to pay to view.... not sure if that was intentionally ironic?
Only in principle though.
I think the reason that Mrs May's government has tried to prepare public opinion for 'the cliff' is to give herself a possible route to early election.
The cliff scenario should also suit remainers. They can fight the next election on a soft brexit with a LibLab coalition platform. They'll give themselves 5 years to sort out a new deal.