Brexit, for once some facts.

[Danidl]

Brexiters objected to the EU on the mistaken grounds that it is undemocratic.

But their champion Theresa May is the dictator stating how we will negotiate to leave the EU and what we will negotiate for.

No prior consultation with our democratic parliament, no chance for parliament to debate and reach an agreement on what we should be negotiating for. Not even a referendum choice of what we should aim for in the event of a Brexit vote.

Just the orders of an unelected dictator with no mandate, foisted upon us when the leader we did vote for departed.
.

I thought that the speech today was very well constructed and delivered. The logic now should be to present the same as a bill to your parliament ., If parliament agreed then she would have a democratic mandate to proceed , trigger the article 50 mechanism and seek to get the best custom union compromise available.
If your parliament rejected that then she would need to present a less ambitious plan.

 

[Lister]

I voted remain.
We will leave.
Mrs May put forward a good case for not being bossed around.
There will be major world players wanting to trade with us.

I am 73 years old, no children, good pension, savings, and no debts
No effect on me, but will be on all my young friends, probably work put OK.

We need to be positive,optimistic and constructive, which I have been all my life.
Just the beginning of some interesting times.

Sleep well.

 

[flecc]

If your parliament rejected that then she would need to present a less ambitious plan.

There won't be a less ambitious plan ready, and would the EU enter yet another negotiation? I don't think so.

But I stand by my post, it was a dictatorial statement of what is to be negotiated for, no prior involvement of our democratic parliament or even the government's own MPs and party.
.

 

[Zlatan]

No one else devotes their entire attention to them as you have, do they?

I suggested you and I stopped bickering. You simply cant , can you ?

 

[oldgroaner]

I suggested you and I stopped bickering. You simply cant , can you ?

And you of course can..I see..

 

[oldgroaner]

I voted remain.
We will leave.
Mrs May put forward a good case for not being bossed around.
There will be major world players wanting to trade with us.

I am 73 years old, no children, good pension, savings, and no debts
No effect on me, but will be on all my young friends, probably work put OK.

We need to be positive,optimistic and constructive, which I have been all my life.
Just the beginning of some interesting times.

Sleep well.

Feel free to be all of those things, it will not affect what is to follow, will it?
This is a great error brought about on the back of an opinion poll that had no legal power.
I am a 72 and in the same position, May simply made a series of statements of intent, none of which were either truthful or likely to prove achievable, and based on very biased assumptions about our own importance and the weakness of the EU.
There is one certainty: the public will bear the cost of this debacle and gain little or no benefit from it, but the elite will prosper.
Otherwise why would they be in favour?
They will take the lower classes to the cleaners for all they can get out of them in every way, it is all about removing any power or privilege the people have built up in a generation, to make profiting from them easier.

 

[oldgroaner]

I thought that the speech today was very well constructed and delivered. The logic now should be to present the same as a bill to your parliament ., If parliament agreed then she would have a democratic mandate to proceed , trigger the article 50 mechanism and seek to get the best custom union compromise available.
If your parliament rejected that then she would need to present a less ambitious plan.

It matters not this thing is unstoppable it has to run it's course.
No good will come of it but eventually with luck the mistake will be corrected.

 

[Zlatan]

And you of course can..I see..

OG
Way back I suggested you and I simply stopped responding to each others posts. You refused to do so. I then suggested we put each other on ignore and did so. You simply carried on posting about my comments.
Can we please simply stop. Its ridiculous. We know we disagree. End of. Just stop it now OG.
And yes I can.
I,ll put you back on ignore, can you please reciprocate.

 

[cookie]

a great day for brexit imho

 

[Woosh]

It's a good day for businesses but I don't think a good day for ordinary folk.
Businesses can look forward to a bit of stability and tax cuts because our post brexit economy will need more stimulation outside the single market. Ordinary people will have to expect continued high inflation, work harder and pay more taxes.

 

[gray198]

There won't be a less ambitious plan ready, and would the EU enter yet another negotiation? I don't think so.

But I stand by my post, it was a dictatorial statement of what is to be negotiated for, no prior involvement of our democratic parliament or even the government's own MPs and party.
.

Flecc I seem to remember that in one of your earlier posts you said that government had to have an element of dictatorship to make it work. I only post this from memory so please correct me if I am wrong

 

[cookie]

It's a good day for businesses but I don't think a good day for ordinary folk.
Businesses can look forward to a bit of stability and tax cuts because our post brexit economy will need more stimulation outside the single market. Ordinary people will have to expect continued high inflation, work harder and pay more taxes.

I was looking further ahead, A good day for my children & grandchildren in the future

 

[Kudoscycles]

If it is too good to be true,it is usually too good to be true and often a scam. May's speech today was delusional,it hinged on this 'associate member' of the customs union that she has dreamed up.
Such a member does not currently exist,May has invented it and now has to sell it to the EU. If she achieves that she gets my vote as saleswoman of the decade.....she wants free trade access to the EU and the ability to go out and make free trade deals with the rest of the world.
If the EU agrees to this then you can imagine all the EU states would want their cake without paying for it.
That would mean we could buy bicycles from China without tariff and sell them into the EU without tariff....but the rest of the other 27 states would continue to pay 48.5% anti dumping duty on bikes in from China.....can anybody think that the EU would be so stupid to allow that.
It would be logical and simple for the EU to put all the current import tariffs from China to the UK onto UK into the EU.....Theresa May will scream that is not fair because it will hurt not only Chinese manufacturers but also UK manufacturers,but why should the EU care,the problem is ours not theirs.
I really liked Theresa May speech but cannot see the content realistic,but I suppose it will shut us all up until we all realise that 'no deal is better than a bad deal'
KudosDave

 

[flecc]

Flecc I seem to remember that in one of your earlier posts you said that government had to have an element of dictatorship to make it work. I only post this from memory so please correct me if I am wrong

Not quite. I posted that for the EU to achieve the transition to one country of Europe demanded a degree of dictatorship, due to the number of countries involved.

Hence the appointed EU Commission, but even they have to consult the EU Parliament and Council to get agreement for their orders.
.

 

[Woosh]

I was looking further ahead, A good day for my children & grandchildren in the future

cookie, I hope brexit will work out for all of us too.

 

[Kudoscycles]

I was looking further ahead, A good day for my children & grandchildren in the future

Cookie...please explain how breaking from trade with the EU is going to be good for our kids?
KudosDave

 

[Woosh]

Mrs May did not expand on her nuclear option. I guess she meant going back to pre 1973.

 

[gray198]

Not quite. I posted that for the EU to achieve the transition to one country of Europe demanded a degree of dictatorship, due to the number of countries involved.

Hence the appointed EU Commission, but even they have to consult the EU Parliament and Council to get agreement for their orders.
.

And as I understand it the final deal will be put to a vote in both houses??

 

[Kudoscycles]

And as I understand it the final deal will be put to a vote in both houses??

Yeh,but who would dare vote against the final deal,May has thought ahead by her comment....No deal is better than bad deal....if it ends up a bad deal she will walk away and settle on WTO tariffs.
If she keeps bank trading,cars and car parts as a free trade deal by her 'associate customs union' that's probably about as good as she can expect....if she tries to threaten by the 'new commercial model',lowering corporation tax to 10% the EU will threaten that we will have punitive tariffs on everything out of the UK,it could end up a trade war.
KudosDave

 

[Woosh]

Inflation will be the measure of success for brexit.
Too much inflation will turn voters against Mrs May.