Brexit, for once some facts.

[oyster]

our government is capable of throwing vast sums at test and trace then it should put twice as much into funding research into treatments and make it an absolute priority.

Wholly agree - as soon as you accept large numbers will get infected, at some point, treatment becomes a priority. Acute and chronic.

I am sure that many medics and scientists are doing their best. But am far less than convinced that the government is doing theirs. On reflection, they probably are but their best is far too bad to be acceptable.

 

[oyster]

And might I suggest , remove the nonsense of a death within 28 days of a positive CV19 test . We know that people linger on for weeks and weeks, often in high dependency or ICU , before finally losing their struggle.

What would you use as the criteria?

If someone dies from, say, a heart attack or cancer while suffering Covid, should we split the attribution of cause? Half each.

I really don't know the answer.

 

[Danidl]

David Frost admits it’s ‘too much trouble’ for firms to trade with Northern Ireland It’s ‘reasonable’ for British firms to give up, says deal negotiator – adding, ‘They decide it’s just not worth it’
The mind Boggles

I fully understand that. It was one thing when the distributor from Manchester, who was dealing with Ireland, took the ferry Liverpool to Belfast, , scooted around a few of the larger supermarket chains dealing with the 1.5Million population and then headed South for a population 3 times bigger, and 150% wealthier. Now they would be trying to do double sets of invoices . It makes more sense to pack the lorry , take the ferry Liverpool to Dublin , go through Irish Customs and service RoI and then bring a few parcels North. The problem is that they failed to do either, and there is a growing paucity of UK goods in the South also. However, we are not starving, French, Danish, Polish, German chocolates are filling the void. What is happening is that numbers of UK high street names are either not reopening or have pulled out , and some still operating eg TKMAXX have slim pickings.

 

[oyster]

Do you think Putin was also behind establishing the incumbent PM?

Kremlin papers appear to show Putin’s plot to put Trump in White House
Exclusive: Documents suggest Russia launched secret multi-agency effort to interfere in US democracy
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jul/15/kremlin-papers-appear-to-show-putins-plot-to-put-trump-in-white-house

 

[oyster]

What is happening is that numbers of UK high street names are either not reopening or have pulled out , and some still operating eg TKMAXX have slim pickings.

I know you wrote "high street names" but to be clear, the ownership is in the USA.

TK Maxx[a] is a subsidiary of the American apparel and home goods company TJX Companies based in Framingham, Massachusetts. It uses a slightly different name from that of the TJ Maxx stores in the United States, to avoid confusion with the British retailer T. J. Hughes.

 

[oyster]

The government utterly fail to govern. I have been saying this for years - the NHS is being ripped off in every direction. This is hydrocortisone. We are still awaiting a similar case re liothyronine.

In both cases, the company changed a branded medicine to become a generic. The government (stupidly) assumed that any medicine which is a generic would be subject to competetitive forces. But if it is the only supplier, especially if it can prevent any other company competing, it can charge anything it likes.

Why has it taken from 2008 to 2021 to achieve this regulator's fine. With no known criminal proceedings against those involved?

UK drug companies fined £260m for inflating prices for NHS
Watchdog issues warning after abuses that included paying would-be rivals to stay out of the market
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/jul/15/uk-drug-companies-fined-260m-overcharging-nhs

 

[Danidl]

What would you use as the criteria?

If someone dies from, say, a heart attack or cancer while suffering Covid, should we split the attribution of cause? Half each.

I really don't know the answer.

One could, but I would prefer to leave that determination to the professional on the spot . Taking myself as an example Had I contracted CV19 prior to October 2020, I would most probably have died. ,From a non apparent heart condition. The cause of death would most certainly have been the Covid... Since I am still writing erudite postings. Had I not contracted CV19, and died it would have been the heart attack.

 

[Danidl]

I know you wrote "high street names" but to be clear, the ownership is in the USA.

TK Maxx[a] is a subsidiary of the American apparel and home goods company TJX Companies based in Framingham, Massachusetts. It uses a slightly different name from that of the TJ Maxx stores in the United States, to avoid confusion with the British retailer T. J. Hughes.

I was aware of that..I even went to one in NYC in 2014 Of course I didn't know or care which was the parent, but certainly that they were linked., . But the stock we get here is primarily UK /EU brands. I suspect that the RoI stores are part of the British distribution chain. A lot of the stock has euro and sterling prices

 

[Jesus H Christ]

We are ahead of schedule. 50K infections / day was forecast by 19/07. We’ve hit 48.5K today, so things are looking good for us to achieve, or even exceed the specified target.

Deaths, we’re doing 63 / day at the moment, but I’m certain we can get it much higher than that.

 

[oyster]

We are ahead of schedule. 50K infections / day was forecast by 19/07. We’ve hit 48.5K today, so things are looking good for us to achieve, or even exceed the specified target.

Deaths, we’re doing 63 / day at the moment, but I’m certain we can get it much higher than that.

Where did the "I so agree with you but it is a pretty sick mess" reaction button go?

 

[Jesus H Christ]

Where did the "I so agree with you but it is a pretty sick mess" reaction button go?

Just keep yourself safe and let the crash test dummies go over the top and into Covid oblivion.

 

[oyster]

Just keep yourself safe and let the crash test dummies go over the top and into Covid oblivion.

We have little reason to go mad - our local favourite restaurant has the highest bookings it has ever had - right through August.

No way will we go until autumn.

 

[oldgroaner]

Here is a rather wonderful example of the erudition of Government officials

From a Home Office letter setting out reasons for refusing asylum to a person from Côte d’Ivoire in 2010

Patel must be proud to follow in this tradition

 

[oyster]

Here is a rather wonderful example of the erudition of Government officials

From a Home Office letter setting out reasons for refusing asylum to a person from Côte d’Ivoire in 2010

Patel must be proud to follow in this tradition

Was that signed? I don't usually feel particularly vindictive about civil servants, but the person who wrote that deserves some payback. The smarmy way they quoted WWF!

 

[jonathan.agnew]

Delusional, no we haven't, that's why we are where we are, a huge swathe of the public have ignored our ineffectual "enforcement". They don't just ignore, they openly defy with large protest demonstrations and marches.

Our infection and death rates show how unsuccessful we've been.
.

I haven't said I'm against any of these things, of course I'm not and they are already happening. That's how you know about them!!

But they all take a lot of time so we need better meanwhile, not jam tomorrow. You're all agreed we are going to get a lot more deaths short term, so make them serve a useful purpose as I've said.

That is using them to frighten the public into behaving better, NOT doing the following which is what they've been doing thoughout:

Hyping the effectiveness of the vaccines with the 90%+ nonsense.

Hyping how well we've been doing.

Hyping the NHS performance

Hyping the advances in successful treatment of Covid.

Constantly reassuring the public about restriction easements on the way.

Not making predictions about huge number of deaths, since when they don't come true the public become cynical.

All these give the public the impression that there's nothing to worry about since it looks under control. That's reinforced by most people not knowing anyone who has died from Covid and often not knowing anyone who's even caught it, so they think "where's the threat?" or even that Covid is faked.

Instead, concentrate on telling the truth and not the positives:

Concentrate on the rising death numbers only when they actually happen, not failing predictions, and without burying the public in silly charts that make it seem they are trying too hard to convince.

Advise getting the vaccines only to reduce your suffering if you catch Covid, but say that as vaccines to prevent catching Covid they are very poor.

Openly admit the NHS is very limited in what it can do to treat Covid once caught.

Regularly report the pressures on crematoriums, burial grounds and funeral directors struggling to cope as the true death numbers rise.

Report on the rise in planning applications to build crematoria.

In a nutshell, just giving the public the gloomy prospects to get the message to sink in.
.

What is your solution? What would you do that is not being done now (furlough, social distancing laws and mandatory face masks are not working). Explain how your strategy would cause the public to behave differently to how they are today and hence reduce infections.

I think flecc is right, people will only learn and behave appropriately for the given situation after experiencing pain. That’s especially true in the U.K. What’s also true is that when the pain hits again, the public will want to blame someone else for their own stupidity.

Non of the above excuses this government for their lack of leadership and clear guidance.

One answer is that you bought into the government's agenda of transferring responsibility and blame for the mismanagement of the pandemic (and thousands of deaths past present and future)onto the publics' shoulders hook line and sinker. Congratulations.

 

[jonathan.agnew]

Just keep yourself safe and let the crash test dummies go over the top and into Covid oblivion.

One advantage of seeing patients with long covid on a daily basis is realising how many innocent victims there are. Today a worker in a care home who lost her job after developing long covid (and chronic fatigue) which intensified preexisting depression, bulimia and culminated in a suicide attempt. Many of those who contract covid are selfless frontline workers, not crash test dummies. But I can appreciate that it's more useful to blame them and consider them expendable from a conservative point of view

 

[flecc]

One answer is that you bought into the government's agenda of transferring responsibility and blame for the mismanagement of the pandemic (and thousands of deaths past present and future)onto the publics' shoulders hook line and sinker. Congratulations.

That's a typical Welfare State answer.

None of the responsibility lies with individuals, the state must provide for everything, even all the actions on Covid.

The truth is that the state has done everything it can, some things less well, others very well. It's spent immense sums to help people to practice social separation, paying them to do it by keeping them off work. It's provided a wide range of vaccines on an epic scale. It's given all the advice possible to assist people to protect themselves.

Now how have these hard done by citizens of yours behaved? Large numbers of those paid to stay away from work have instead of staying home, socialised with numbers of others, including crowding onto beaches or at sports events. Some 19% of them of 50 years and over have not accepted the vaccines. A substantial number deny Covid even exists and often don't mask where they should. They even organise large marches and demonstrations protesting against the help the government is giving and campaign against the government's Covid help online.

But you think none of the poor outcomes we've had are their fault !!
.

 

[Jesus H Christ]

That's a typical Welfare State answer.

None of the responsibility lies with individuals, the state must provide for everything, even all the actions on Covid.

The truth is that the state has done everything it can, some things less well, others very well. It's spent immense sums to help people to practice social separation, paying them to do it by keeping them off work. It's provided a wide range of vaccines on an epic scale. It's given all the advice possible to assist people to protect themselves.

Now how have these hard done by citizens of yours behaved? Large numbers of those paid to stay away from work have instead of staying home, socialised with numbers of others, including crowding onto beaches or at sports events. Some 19% of them of 50 years and over have not accepted the vaccines. A substantial number deny Covid even exists and often don't mask where they should. They even organise large marches and demonstrations protesting against the help the government is giving and campaign against the government's Covid help online.

But you think none of the poor outcomes we've had are their fault !!
.

I totally agree with most of that, but leadership and clarity has been very poor. Lack of leadership will have caused many unnecessary deaths, but by no means all of them.

 

[daveboy]

Here is a rather wonderful example of the erudition of Government officials

From a Home Office letter setting out reasons for refusing asylum to a person from Côte d’Ivoire in 2010

Patel must be proud to follow in this tradition

Not his fault...ex Irish military..his last mission was to kill all the gorillas and release the ostriches.

 

[Jesus H Christ]

One advantage of seeing patients with long covid on a daily basis is realising how many innocent victims there are. Today a worker in a care home who lost her job after developing long covid (and chronic fatigue) which intensified preexisting depression, bulimia and culminated in a suicide attempt. Many of those who contract covid are selfless frontline workers, not crash test dummies. But I can appreciate that it's more useful to blame them and consider them expendable from a conservative point of view

Yes, those cases are very disturbing indeed and I feel for those workers who will be forced to face large numbers of the public after Johnson’s mask burning day on Monday. Those workers have been betrayed and badly let down by this government.

However, even more cases of Covid will develop due to the antics of Mr Fireworks up the Arse Hole man and Mr Poo in a Burger Box on a Beach (whilst on furlough) man. I’m afraid this is what the British public is like. These idiots will be going over the top to the sound of Boris’s whistle at dawn on Monday. As they advance on the Covid guidelines, determined to defeat them, many will fall. They’ve been warned, but sometimes you’ve gotta learn the hard way. This is one such occasion.