Bosch Motor Types

[bikey850]

Hello,

Under what circumstances would you suggest that the Performance CX is worth it over the Performance Line model?

They are quite a bit more expensive and wonder if they are worth it on a MTB that's 80% used for commuting (with rack).

Are the CX harder to peddle when off than the Performance Line and do they both have the same internal mechanisms roughly - ie not one plastic gears the other metal etc?

I know that there are power differences (can see from the Bosch website) and that the CX has the new eMTB mode but I don't think thats such a difference.

Forgetting about brand of bike really just lookin for some general advice ideally from those who work in the trade and often advise customers about these things.

Thanks in advance,

 

[Gringo]

Bosch's own website explains each motors best uses
https://www.bosch-ebike.com/en/products/drive-unit/
Bosch motor generations
1st gen included both an active and performance version, mechanically the same but the performance motor has a higher max power. There is a gear reduction within the motor that's noticeable when the powers off or above the cutoff speed.
2nd gen is the CX, the most powerful motor but again there's the internal gear reduction.
3rd gen new for 2018 2 versions also called active line and active line plus, both with lower max power than either of the above motors and with no gear reduction there said to give a more natural ride (and quieter) aimed at those of us that like to ride "off power" quite often.

Personally I've come from the original active motor (60nm) in the early days i used max assist on muddy accents that you'd struggle to walk up but soon changed my prefered routes and soon found that I didn't need max power that often, if atall.
I am now waiting for delivery of the new active line plus motor (50nm) and that should suit my needs just fine.

 

[bikey850]

Hello,

Thank you for reply. All makes complete sense ... but assuming choice is between Performance Line and Performance CX why would I choose one over the other?

Is it simply additional torque? Do they both have same mechanism or is CX model more robust (more metal parts).

Appologies in advance for my stupidity not understanding the real world difference.

 

[soundwave]

the motors are mostly the same inside just smaller or bigger on the outside for less waight but the cx has more torque 75 vs 63 and it is a bit smaller than performance line.

note also the performance line motor is for also sclass bikes 45kph but there is no difference inside but less torque more speed via different software settings.

 

[soundwave]

 

[Gringo]

After the performance line Bosch made the CX motor, smaller, lighter and more powerful, predominantly for proper MTB's as opposed to there other motors designed for leisure, commuter and adventure bikes.
To my knowllage There's been very little trouble reported with the performance line but the CX motor dose seem to have bearing issues.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

It's now been made a lot more complicated by the different versions. If it were me choosing, I'd avoid any Bosch motors with the small drive sprocket. They have much more drag than the ones with the large sprockets and there's various reliability issues associated with them.

Torque isn't important if you only use the bike on the road. Even the very first Bosch motor had enough for any hill. You only need the high torque if you're doing serious off-road riding or want to dongle the bike for high speed, but then it sucks your battery.

 

[Gringo]

Torque isn't important if you only use the bike on the road. Even the very first Bosch motor had enough for any hill. You only need the high torque if you're doing serious off-road riding or want to dongle the bike for high speed, but then it sucks your battery.

That's my thoughts exactly and why I'm opting for the 3 gen Bosch motor in my next bike (mid Feb hopefully)

 

[bikey850]

Thank you - but a bit harder for 3 gen currently as many MTB types are either Performance Line or CX with the 3rd gen more for commuters it seems.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Thank you - but a bit harder for 3 gen currently as many MTB types are either Performance Line or CX with the 3rd gen more for commuters it seems.

Get a Shimano then!

 

[1boris]

I wouldn buy anything right now.I would wait for the new bafang M-500 motor with 95nm.There is also many other new motors coming this year with around 100nm .And also bigger batteries

 

[EddiePJ]

You only need the high torque if you're doing serious off-road riding.

And even then, I'm not so sure.

Having had both the Performance Line and CX, I consider that the Performance Line has more than enough torque for any situation. I don't get this obsession with higher and higher torque motors.

Unless of course the rider wants to put less and less effort in for the same gain, and is just plain lazy.

One example springs to mind. In this example it would be more efficient to have used a Performance line motor linked to the 500wh battery. With the same climbing time stats, having more in reserve battery wise, would make more sense.

 

[Ducknald Don]

Unless of course the rider wants to put less and less effort in for the same gain, and is just plain lazy.

You could use that argument for e-bikes in general.

 

[Ducknald Don]

To my knowledge there's been very little trouble reported with the performance line but the CX motor does seem to have bearing issues.

It's all anecdotal though, I haven't seen anything resembling real evidence.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

It's all anecdotal though, I haven't seen anything resembling real evidence.

of the non CX motors being less reliable or the CX actually being problematic?

 

[Gringo]

Thank you - but a bit harder for 3 gen currently as many MTB types are either Performance Line or CX with the 3rd gen more for commuters it

I have the cube acid one 500 on order, I'm sure it will be good for longer trail riding days
https://www.cube.eu/en/2018/e-bikes/mountain/hardtail/acid/cube-acid-hybrid-one-500-29-greennblack-2018/

 

[Gringo]

I wouldn buy anything right now.I would wait for the new bafang M-500 motor with 95nm.There is also many other new motors coming this year with around 100nm .And

Why bother, just get one of these
https://www.google.co.uk/search?safe=off&client=safari&hl=en-gb&biw=1024&bih=671&tbm=isch&sa=1&ei=UF9vWqOUFuHNgAbc34jYBw&sjs=1&q=ccm+400+street+scrambler&oq=ccm+400+street+scrambler&gs_l=mobile-gws-img.3...19195.51393.0.53196.24.22.2.0.0.0.378.3075.10j5j5j1.21.0....0...1.1.64.mobile-gws-img..1.10.1909...0j0i8i30k1j0i30k1j30i10k1.490.Gp7I-nziXp4#imgrc=XBQZOUvuhd2KHM:

 

[1boris]

Why bother, just get one of these
https://www.google.co.uk/search?safe=off&client=safari&hl=en-gb&biw=1024&bih=671&tbm=isch&sa=1&ei=UF9vWqOUFuHNgAbc34jYBw&sjs=1&q=ccm+400+street+scrambler&oq=ccm+400+street+scrambler&gs_l=mobile-gws-img.3...19195.51393.0.53196.24.22.2.0.0.0.378.3075.10j5j5j1.21.0....0...1.1.64.mobile-gws-img..1.10.1909...0j0i8i30k1j0i30k1j30i10k1.490.Gp7I-nziXp4#imgrc=XBQZOUvuhd2KHM:

That was a stupid comparison.So now suddenly we want low power ebikes with small batteries.

 

[Trevormonty]

of the non CX motors being less reliable or the CX actually being problematic?

Mud, dirt and regular hosing down from MTBing is more likely cause. Do same with active or performance motors and they would most likely have high bearing failures.

 

[Trevormonty]

I wouldn buy anything right now.I would wait for the new bafang M-500 motor with 95nm.There is also many other new motors coming this year with around 100nm .And also bigger batteries

I've never found CX 75nm in turbo mode lacking in power offroad. For most single trail riding it is too much, tour and eco being lot more manageable.
Activeline plus 50nm would be fine for most riding especially with decent gear range.