BEBA's question to Norman Baker

Wisper Bikes

Trade Member
Apr 11, 2007
6,282
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Sevenoaks Kent
Further to BEBA's attendance yesterday at the All Party Parliamentary Cycle Group, I felt Pedelec readers may be interested in a brief report.

By Victoria Sowter
BEBA

Back in September, Norman Baker, the Under Secretary of State for Transport, whose remit includes cycling, announced the Local Sustainability Transport Fund (LSTF). This will be a massive £560m that local authorities can bid for over the next four financial years. Details are currently being written in a White Paper on local transport and will include packages of measures (i.e. not just pouring concrete) “that support economic growth and reduce carbon…as well as delivering cleaner environments, improved safety and increased levels of physical activity.”

Electrically Assisted Bicycles will fit the bill perfectly we reckon at BEBA, and we want local authority officials to be made more aware of their potential. To this end Sabine and I attended the All Party Parliamentary Cycling Group as representatives of BEBA on 1st December and posed the following question to Norman Baker himself:

Given that research shows hilliness to be the most significant physical determinant of commuter cycling levels and that 25% of all car commuter journeys lie between 5 and 10 miles, do you agree that electrically assisted bicycles have an important role to play in sustainable transport policy?

If so, will they be receiving a mention in the forthcoming White Paper on local transport and in the guidance to local authorities on the Local Sustainable Transport Fund?

The Minister quipped “Put like that we will now”. He went on to say he could see their advantages and would support them but expressed concerns about the health impacts of people who transfer from pedal cycles. I’ll be following through his concerns with the help of research compiled by Richard Peace (www.excellentbooks.co.uk). It’s a doubly important issue given recent proposed changes to the public health arena; another policy area we want to influence. Meanwhile the Minister wanted to try out an electric bike, particularly as Lewes, his home constituency is very hilly. Guess that puts him top of the list of invitees to our Spring electric cycling event at the House of Lords then!

At the same meeting Norman Baker announced there’s to be a national cycling indicator which will monitor cycling levels by local authority area. I need to confirm this, but it seems likely that as most local authorities use automatic counters, electrically assisted bicycles will be included in the tally. This means that local authorities will be highly motivated to consider cycling of all kinds from both a monitoring and financial perspective. My hunch is that partnerships between the public sector and businesses will be flavour of the moment for these LSTF bids so get your thinking caps on as to how you can work creatively with local authorities to promote your products.

As part of this mix ACT TravelWise can also help get the concept of EABs across to a wider audience. Not to be confused with the Association of Cycle Traders, this body offers networking and training opportunities to those involved in encouraging behavioural change to more sustainable modes through travel plans for schools, businesses and individuals. Their policy team are considering a submission I made to them recently as part of their national policy document.

Raising awareness is fine, but what about some help in making purchases? The Cycle to Work Alliance have asked Norman Baker about the tax changes to the Cycle to Work Scheme and received the heartening response that he has written to the Treasury to ask them to reconsider the situation.

Talking of getting financial help, the Government through the Office of Low Emission Vehicles (OLEV) are currently encouraging demand for low emission electric cars to the tune of £450m in order to create new jobs and make the transport system more sustainable. Seizing an opportunity at November’s Eco2Transport show, Mark Loveridge, Ultramotor’s MD and secretary to BEBA, met with Norman Baker, along with Michael Hurwitz and Tom Elliot of OLEV. He asked that the electric bicycle industry also receive a financial boost given its potential contribution to the economy and environment. They agreed to consider a business case. Mark and I will be pulling this together over the coming weeks following a set framework. Any offers of help or suggestions will be gratefully received.

And finally…I’ve had confirmation from Claire Rees, the lead officer at the Department for Transport that there’s no change yet regarding 2002/24/EC and the 1983 GB regulations. They’re hoping to get last March’s consultation responses on to their website soon along with proposed next steps. They’re also involved with European level discussions on changes to 2002/24/EC. I’m aware that the European Twowheel Retailers’ Association have come up with various options and will have more on this in our next issue.

Regards

David
 

eddieo

Banned
Jul 7, 2008
5,070
6
No rush on my acount.... I want a new 2011 Wisper bike (with operational throttle:mad: ) before regs change!:eek:
 

EdBike

Pedelecer
Sep 10, 2010
181
0
Interesting developments David, thanks for sharing. A couple of quick questions.

The £450 million "low-emissions" budge; do you know what it's been spent on at the moment. Hybrid car technologies? Anything to do with cycling? Would be interesting (and persuasive) to be able to compare potential rewards investing in electric bikes vs. other things they're already spending money on.

Second, about this point...

Raising awareness is fine, but what about some help in making purchases?
But when you posed your question to Mr Baker, and communicated the immediate, compelling benefits of EABs he immediately bought into the idea that this is something he needed to look at. He became aware.

Whilst the help making purchases is important, it's possibly more down to the industry (quality dealers, lots of useful information, payment plans etc.). I think the big wins, based on what you've posted, are in raising awareness with Local Authorities about the Local Sustainability Transport Fund (LSTF).

Good dealers know how to convert the sale; they struggle with the awareness problem. Look at the right-hand column of adverts on this forum; every man and his dog is out advertising the same thing.

David, I'd be very interested to help with this where I can. PM me when you need a hand!
 

JuicyBike

Trade Member
Jan 26, 2009
1,671
527
Derbyshire
Good work David. It's great that BEBA are busy. Would be nice to get some regular updates and to become more involved. Email me if you have any BEBA events coming up - still hoping to be of assistance.

(Also, if you could see your way to listing us on the BEBA website... still waiting since approval in June)
 

Wisper Bikes

Trade Member
Apr 11, 2007
6,282
2,252
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Sevenoaks Kent
No rush on my acount.... I want a new 2011 Wisper bike (with operational throttle:mad: ) before regs change!:eek:
Hi Eddie

We will always have throttles on our bikes although they will be restricted to 4mph in EU mode.

All our bikes, with throttles have passed the stringent EN15194 certification process already. So throttles are definitely OK and legal for start off and use when the pedals are simply turning. A rider does not have to put any force into the system.

In addition to using the throttle to pull off from the kerb I use it to vary the amount of assistance I need whilst riding, it is so much more efficient than simply turning the power onto level six.

I attended a meeting with the BA on Monday where a representative of the DfT said that they were still looking at throttle usage, it will be interesting to hear their final decision.

All the best

David
 

brucehawsker

Pedelecer
Dec 17, 2009
119
0
David,

Thank you for your sterling work here. I have been raising awareness in other parts of the government though chats and a couple of dinners. I am madly busy at the moment as you are aware, and the snow does not help. But I was especially pleased with your report of the comment from Claire. I gather that there is little enthusiasm to implement changes on a whole raft of EN regs in a number of areas - cut backs in staff numbers and other more important fish to fry. My read is we are unlikely to see change in 2011, and even then I would not care to bet what will be our outcome. We are bucking the euro-trend in marine regs in maufacture at the moment.....

Again, great to see BEBA doing the stuff.

Bruce
 

Wisper Bikes

Trade Member
Apr 11, 2007
6,282
2,252
69
Sevenoaks Kent
The £450 million "low-emissions" budget; do you know what it's been spent on at the moment. Hybrid car technologies? Anything to do with cycling? Would be interesting (and persuasive) to be able to compare potential rewards investing in electric bikes vs. other things they're already spending money on.
It is all a bit misty, however we were told at the BA meeting that this fund was purely to be used to move people from internal combustion engined passenger cars into electric cars and even quadrocycles like the G-Whizz would not be considered for subsidy.

We are working in a solution.

Regards

David
 

z0mb13e

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jul 28, 2009
578
3
Dorset
That all sounds positive, and I was wondering what happened about the consultation.

I will also be happy to be able to purchase an ebike in 2011 with a full power throttle - as only today it saved my bacon when my dérailleur froze in a low gear, I got to work in a reasonable time because I was able to use the throttle.

It was also a life saver being able to coast over icy paths without the movement from pedalling unbalancing the bike.

Keep the updates coming!
 

Wisper Bikes

Trade Member
Apr 11, 2007
6,282
2,252
69
Sevenoaks Kent
But when you posed your question to Mr Baker, and communicated the immediate, compelling benefits of EABs he immediately bought into the idea that this is something he needed to look at. He became aware.

Whilst the help making purchases is important, it's possibly more down to the industry (quality dealers, lots of useful information, payment plans etc.). I think the big wins, based on what you've posted, are in raising awareness with Local Authorities about the Local Sustainability Transport Fund (LSTF).

Good dealers know how to convert the sale; they struggle with the awareness problem. Look at the right-hand column of adverts on this forum; every man and his dog is out advertising the same thing.

David, I'd be very interested to help with this where I can. PM me when you need a hand!
I agree Ed (thanks for your comments) through BEBA and the BA we are very keen to make sure that people offering electric bikes are of a high enough caliber to both understand the market and offer a high level of service. We at BEBA will be talking more about this next year. One of the major problems we are all experiencing is the lack of clarity on regulations. There are currently companies out there telling dealers that throttles are ilegal! Misinformed or hard selling?

I know all but one of the pedelec advertisers, their products represent a good cross section of the better electric bikes available.

Now BEBA has finally been incorporated, we will start in earnest next year to raise awareness in all the areas you mention. We have published a code of practice that all members adhere to. Ensuring both the bikes and quality of service offered by BEBA members are of a level to help instill confidence in the electric bike buying public and in IBD's who have not yet embraced the electric bike movement.

I appreciate your input and would be delighted if you would like to lend a hand, it is a tough battle and the more help we get the better.

I will PM you.

Best regards

David
 

Wisper Bikes

Trade Member
Apr 11, 2007
6,282
2,252
69
Sevenoaks Kent
Good work David. It's great that BEBA are busy. Would be nice to get some regular updates and to become more involved. Email me if you have any BEBA events coming up - still hoping to be of assistance.

(Also, if you could see your way to listing us on the BEBA website... still waiting since approval in June)
Hi Bob, sorry about the delay, we have had problems registering as a Community Interest Company and using the word British in our name, so we can t open a bank account and therefore cannot accept membership from new companies. This situation is all but resolved now. As soon as we have an account we will be sending out acceptance notices with invoices!

The next BEBA meeting will be held on 11th January all members will be invited, Juicy included.

All the best

David
 
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rogerl

Just Joined
Oct 23, 2010
4
0
Liverpool, L23
He went on to say he could see their advantages and would support them but expressed concerns about the health impacts of people who transfer from pedal cycles
Maybe a little in that, but I'd suggest that it is outweighed by the number of people like me who encouraged by the pedelec are getting back out of our cars and onto our bikes.

As we all know you can assist as much as you like, so a good workout is still possible.
 

TylerD

Pedelecer
Jul 8, 2010
175
0
Hi David , you said that "We will always have throttles on our bikes although they will be restricted to 4mph in EU mode". Does that mean that the throttle will be capable of being de-restricted and if so to what speed?
 

Wisper Bikes

Trade Member
Apr 11, 2007
6,282
2,252
69
Sevenoaks Kent
Hi David , you said that "We will always have throttles on our bikes although they will be restricted to 4mph in EU mode". Does that mean that the throttle will be capable of being de-restricted and if so to what speed?
Hi Tyler

Although electric bikes with throttles will be sold with the 4mph limiter in place, like the speed controller it may be possible to take the limiters off so the throttle will work up to the maximum speed of the motor.

We at Wisper do not advocate this and anyone making such alterations must understand that they will be converting their legal bike into a vehicle that does not comply with the law and therefore should never use the derestricted bike on the public road.

Regards

David
 
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eddieo

Banned
Jul 7, 2008
5,070
6
Surely bikes will be supplied with full throttle until the law changes?
 

Wisper Bikes

Trade Member
Apr 11, 2007
6,282
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69
Sevenoaks Kent
Hi Eddie

Until the law changes we are happy to make the necessary adjustment to the bikes and make throttle available up full speed.

However as the bikes now arrive in the UK set to EN15194 spec. you will need to check with your supplier that the bike has been modified for full throttle use. It is a simple modification which involves re-programming the controller to US specification and takes about 10 minutes.

All the best

David
 
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Wisper Bikes

Trade Member
Apr 11, 2007
6,282
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Sevenoaks Kent
Of course the beauty of this is if you ever take your bike into Europe or the DfT clamp down on full throttle use in the UK, it is a ten minute job to re-restrict the throttle to the full EN standard.

Regards

David
 

TylerD

Pedelecer
Jul 8, 2010
175
0
Thanks David. I'm thinking of a new Alpino next year so that's really good to know:)