Anybody who has spent time on an e-bike exhibition stand,will appreciate this thread

[Kudoscycles]

We get asked the same questions a hundred times a day...and I give pretty much the same answers.
How far does it go....depends how much pedal power you input,what is the terrain,how much you weigh,how big is the battery,eco or turbo PAS setting....but with average rider,average power input,average terrain we advise 3 miles per Ah battery,put Wiggo on and turn the power off and you can get UP TO 500 MILES!
Will it charge when you pedal.....the straight answer is no,some bikes have regenerative braking but the return is so inefficient that is not worth the effort,also spoils the joy of freewheeling downhill.
How long does it take to charge...2Ah charger,10Ah battery....max 5 hours,average 3-4 hours.
What's the difference between a torque sensor and speed sensor....speed sensor is a rotary switch,turn pedals you get power,you can vary that power using the display. Torque sensor requires effort in to get motor power,gives an intuitive ride but not for a lazy rider.
I have been told that to go up hills I need a crank drive bike....Bosch have done a wonderful marketing job...5 years ago that was the case comparing the hub motors at that time but the Bafang BPM motor is also a good hill climber and avoids the complication of highly loaded chain and gear system,it also tends to be much cheaper.
How do I make it go faster,under power,than 15 mph....if you want to stay legal as a bicycle,to use on bike tracks,promenades,the highway you cannot have power above 15mph....but if you want to risk it and many do there are dongles or tweekable displays that will increase the speed,however you do that at your own risk.
I have heard there are faster bikes in Germany....you probably mean S-class but they are not legal here.
I want a bike with a throttle....up to 4 mph that's ok,full speed throttles up to 15 mph will be outlawed from January 2016,if you buy before you are ok.
I want to ride alongside my partner,his Bianchi beats me up hills....with an e-bike and modest pedal power you should beat your partner up a steep hill.
How long will the battery last....the heavy LifePo4 batteries seem to have an immortal life,our early bikes are still going strong after 5 years....the lighter LiMNo4,lithium ion,lithium polymer should have a life about 3-4 years,however the batteries seem to go on much longer than that,good to ask how much is a replacement battery when buying the bike.
Can I take it on a plane....only if the battery is less than 4Ah capacity.
Having just exhibited 4 days at the NEC cycle show I thought it useful to write down the popular questions,the understanding of an e-bike is improving but there are still many customers who do not know the basics. Obviously my answers are my own opinions and I point them in the direction of this forum if they want to dig deeper in the knowledge trough.
Apologies for 'sucking eggs' to many of you.
I don't hear the comment 'that's cheating' any more,public attitudes to the use of electric bikes is clearly changing and are more socially acceptable,even amongst the Lycra clad Specialised or Bianchi rider.
KudosDave

 

[Alan Quay]

Get this printed on a t-shirt:

 

[Nealh]

Or any exhibition stand , sounds like you were kept busy Dave, I know the feeling of the 20 Q's pitch from every punter that stops and enquires. I have in the past manning the stand at beekeeping events and by the end of the day you feel worn out and also the fact you are on your feet all day.

 

[Kudoscycles]

I really like that!!!
Probably not PC.
KudosDave

 

[Kudoscycles]

Or any exhibition stand , sounds like you were kept busy Dave, I know the feeling of the 20 Q's pitch from every punter that stops and enquires. I have in the past manning the stand at beekeeping events and by the end of the day you feel worn out and also the fact you are on your feet all day.

Do wasps also make honey....?

 

[Nealh]

Do wasps also make honey....?

Nice one Dave.

 

[flecc]

Never on e-bikes, but I've done daily stand duties for as much as seven days and it's exhausting. I remember one occasion when young, two of us ducked out for a couple of hours by deliberately causing the hotel lift to fail and lock up between floors when heading down for breakfast, even stuck in a lift was better than stand duty.
.

 

[Kudoscycles]

Flecc.....I never know whether exhibitions are more tiring for the visitors or the exhibitors,but certainly the environment is exhausting by 6 o'clock keen to get back to the hotel and get the brain back into gear.
I did the Essen Motorsport show in West Germany,10 days,300,000 plus visitors ,some days 10-10,most conversations through an interpreter,needed a break after that one.
Actually I am back at the NEC ,mid November,for the classic car and motorcycle show,that show is so interesting for our generation,it is my favourite show,the old Jags,Ferraris,Norton and Triumph motorbikes....my speciality is parts for the old Ford Escorts....Rally Design. We will have a small display of e-bikes,taking the Rapide,Sonata,Tornado and Secret.
Am also back early January 2016 for the Autosports show,ex the racing car show,we will have a couple of e-bikes on our stand.
At one time the apres activities were enjoyable for my staff,out late in some dodgy club in the middle of Birmingham but we are good boys these days,getting older and early to bed.
I know this posting is remote from e-bikes but e-bike customers often have an interest in all forms of transport especially classic vehicles.
Thanks
KudosDave

 

[Jimod]

I stood on the canal towpath explaining to one 'chap' why my bike didn't charge up while pedalling. I thought I'd covered it all, I explained that the extra effort in pedalling to charge wasn't worth the effort and when I finished, he simply says, "I think they should make one where the extra effort is worth it.

 

[flecc]

I stood on the canal towpath explaining to one 'chap' why my bike didn't charge up while pedalling. I thought I'd covered it all, I explained that the extra effort in pedalling to charge wasn't worth the effort and when I finished, he simply says, "I think they should make one where the extra effort is worth it.

What does that say about the vast amount of money we've spent on education over the last 50 years or so?

We definitely aren't getting value for money from it when such a total failure to understand basic physics is evident.
.

 

[Kudoscycles]

I looked at a new e-bike at Eurobike, the sign said the bike never needed charging,it was a crowdfunding exercise,I asked the salesman how big was the battery,he didn't know (?) but he said it didn't need a big battery .....it charged up whilst you were riding especially downhill,to retain enough charge to get up the next hill and so on.
So you have done it....a perpetual motion machine,which gives more energy out than you put in,with no losses.
The bike was very light,only 14 kilos,skinny low friction tyres,the motor,controller and battery were built into a hub in the rear wheel.
I pressed the salesman,to be fair being very helpful....so if I ride 5 Kms along on the flat,that would take more effort to turn the dynamo to charge the small battery....I come to a 15% hill,how far would that charge get me up the hill? The guy was strong on enthusiasm not so good on detail.
Is it practical to get enough energy into the battery on the flat to usefully use on hill climbing?
In a similar vein has anyone bought or tried the Mando Footloose,I think that works similarly.
KudosDave

 

[flecc]

In a similar vein has anyone bought or tried the Mando Footloose,I think that works similarly.
KudosDave

The proof is in the fact that if the battery is flat or removed, no matter how hard ones spins the pedals, the Mando Footloose will not take off and carry one along the road normally. It therefore depends on some additional current from the battery, even on the flat. It fails because in charging it's battery that energy conversion has intrinsic loss, sapping effort that on a normal bike would drive the bike along. Then of course any charge the battery has accepted undergoes a second efficiency loss when it's converted back from it's chemical state into electrical current for the motor. The total of those two losses would probably alone propel a bicycle on the flat.

We've seen plenty of demonstrations over the years of strong cyclists pedalling a generator to provide current for something. They've been such things as lighting, a fridge, a candy floss machine or charging a battery, all low demand and far below the current an e-bike needs. In most cases the cyclist has found it exhausting, packing in after a few minutes demonstrating.
.

 

[anotherkiwi]

I looked at a new e-bike at Eurobike, the sign said the bike never needed charging,it was a crowdfunding exercise,I asked the salesman how big was the battery,he didn't know (?) but he said it didn't need a big battery .....it charged up whilst you were riding especially downhill,to retain enough charge to get up the next hill and so on.

And pigs fly, Elvis isn't dead....

There is a tendancy towards ultra light bikes with low assistance levels (125-150W) for strong riders. Just that little extra to help on hills. But when salesmen sell such bikes to "ordinary" riders, and they will, the negative feedback will kill their dreams of wealth, fame and glory in the egg methinks.

 

[Cyclezee]

]
Except if it has a Ansmann or Heinzmann DD motor
3 assist levels and 3 regen levels, braking not necessary

 

[wightrider]

I don't hear the comment 'that's cheating' any more,public attitudes to the use of electric bikes is clearly changing and are more socially acceptable,even amongst the Lycra clad Specialised or Bianchi rider.
KudosDave[/QUOTE]

I tend to agree with this. I've had the lycra clad guys look quite interested and point it out when they see it, even though it's a unisex Freego. To be honest after riding the e bike I found my regular alloy frame bike so much lighter,quicker and easier to use, but I could only get to that point after improving my fitness on the e-bike whilst commuting further than I would on a regular bike.

 

[wightrider]

Quote: I know this posting is remote from e-bikes but e-bike customers often have an interest in all forms of transport especially classic vehicles.
Thanks
KudosDave

Agree with that too, my 80's 2 stroke bike restoration is fighting for the funds for a new e-bike battery

 

[bigearsbilly]

My 1986 XT600 rebuild is on hold too! Crank in the hall engine in the greenhouse

 

[cosybike]

So far - 100% "you're cheating" for me, from anyone that has passed comment.

 

[stumpy150]

my neighbour who is a mad keen road cyclist called my bike cheating UNTIL he had a go...then purchased one 2 weeks later !!