Help! Advice on choosing rear hub motor/kit

[Steve J H]

Hi All
Looking at DWG22C 48v 250w 60nm from Woosh, they only supply with 12ah battery, prefer 15ah. Any alternative recommendations would be very welcome. Currently enjoying my BBS01 but time for another build. I know a hub motor won't climb like a mid motor but looking for a more relaxed ride, however more torque the better (18st + knackered knees).
Would be nice to keep things legal if possible. MInd you living in a town centre iam constantly being overtaken and cut up by e scooters and Deliveroo boys with 1000w hubs, sorry that should be another thread.

 

[Nealh]

That's still 576wh of battery use, comparable to 16ah at 36v.

If you are after battery capacity then the 1000w motors aren't the option.

 

[Steve J H]

That's still 576wh of battery use, comparable to 16ah at 36v.

If you are after battery capacity then the 1000w motors aren't the option.

Thanks Nealh
Current set up is 17.5ah 36vBBS01B gives me 40 mile range average with fairly high assistance levels, would like to at least match this.
Would like to stay at 250w if possible, sorry my reference to 1000w was a clumsy attempt at humour. 350w seems popular amongst forum members, is this an optimum for torque/battery life?
I will contact woosh to see if there are larger 48v H/L batteries in the pipe line.

 

[Jodel]

We have the Woosh DWG22C kit & the 12Ah battery on our tandem and I've been impressed with how much torque and range it has. I would certainly recommend it (and Woosh) based on our experience. It has no trouble propelling us along the road or climbing hills - although I should qualify that by saying that we bought the motor to augment rather than replace our efforts. I like to keep my heart rate up and we still add a fair bit of power via the pedals! We're a relatively lightweight team and weigh in at around 130Kgs plus 35Kgs for the tandem itself.

Most of the time we use low levels of assist - normally just 1 or 2. Very rarely do we need level 3 or more unless the hill is really steep. In terms of range, I've not gone beyond 50 miles before a recharge. The LCD display was still showing 80% remaining capacity at that mileage, but it will probably be a good bit less than that. Voltage after charge was 54.2 and after 50 miles was 47.8, so I'd guess it is likely that we used up closer to 70% of the battery capacity.

I was sufficiently impressed with the kit to purchase a second one for one of my solo bikes. At my weight, it's probably overkill for a solo, but I wanted to keep components common between the solo and the tandem.

 

[Nealh]

Thanks Nealh
Current set up is 17.5ah 36vBBS01B gives me 40 mile range average with fairly high assistance levels, would like to at least match this.
Would like to stay at 250w if possible, sorry my reference to 1000w was a clumsy attempt at humour. 350w seems popular amongst forum members, is this an optimum for torque/battery life?
I will contact woosh to see if there are larger 48v H/L batteries in the pipe line.

350W means nothing, the important number/s is the current rating of the controller. 12a a bit weedy, 15a fairly average and then for better power 17 or 20a are now being seen a lot more. Optionally some of us opt for a bit more power and use 22 or 25a controllers.
250/350w are identical the 250w rating for a lot of the world doesn't cut it in the USA but strangely 350w does so most China hub motors are marked 350w, custom models for UK are marked 250w and some on Topbikekit now also have the 250w marking.

 

[Nealh]

Your current battery will have 9.5% more capacity then the 12a 48v set up.

 

[Steve J H]

We have the Woosh DWG22C kit & the 12Ah battery on our tandem and I've been impressed with how much torque and range it has. I would certainly recommend it (and Woosh) based on our experience. It has no trouble propelling us along the road or climbing hills - although I should qualify that by saying that we bought the motor to augment rather than replace our efforts. I like to keep my heart rate up and we still add a fair bit of power via the pedals! We're a relatively lightweight team and weigh in at around 130Kgs plus 35Kgs for the tandem itself.

Most of the time we use low levels of assist - normally just 1 or 2. Very rarely do we need level 3 or more unless the hill is really steep. In terms of range, I've not gone beyond 50 miles before a recharge. The LCD display was still showing 80% remaining capacity at that mileage, but it will probably be a good bit less than that. Voltage after charge was 54.2 and after 50 miles was 47.8, so I'd guess it is likely that we used up closer to 70% of the battery capacity.

I was sufficiently impressed with the kit to purchase a second one for one of my solo bikes. At my weight, it's probably overkill for a solo, but I wanted to keep components common between the solo and the tandem.

Thanks, a good endorsement. I have been to Woosh a couple of times to look at various models, unfortunately all to small despite Tony's best efforts to adjust. Ended up down the self build route

 

[Steve J H]

350W means nothing, the important number/s is the current rating of the controller. 12a a bit weedy, 15a fairly average and then for better power 17 or 20a are now being seen a lot more. Optionally some of us opt for a bit more power and use 22 or 25a controllers.
250/350w are identical the 250w rating for a lot of the world doesn't cut it in the USA but strangely 350w does so most China hub motors are marked 350w, custom models for UK are marked 250w and some on Topbikekit now also have the 250w marking.

Thanks, very informative. Seems like I would be better to source individual components to tailor the end result.

 

[Nealh]

Woosh give piece of mind with some very good CS, their controller s are about 17a but specs need checking to be sure.

 

[vfr400]

Hi All
Currently enjoying my BBS01 but time for another build. I know a hub motor won't climb like a mid motor

That Woosh kit will blow your BBS01 into the weeds when it comes to climbing. It'll tow the unpowered BBS01 bike up the hill quicker than what the BBS01 bike could go on it's own.

 

[Deleted member 16246]

Quite new to the Pedelec thing, so pinch of salt needed maybe, but my BS01 is not that great at climbing hills, though I do have some monster hills to climb here with 800 foot climbs in a couple of miles. My partner who is 5 feet 1 and weighs about 9 stone easily catches me up on her Somerby on some of them and I am puffing like Stephenson's Rocket. I weigh a tad over twelve stone, so not a heavy lad. I hear her shout, 'Coming by', and she does. The Somerby is probably about the most basic 250 watt hub motor and control outfit there is.. Maybe I am running my BS01 in too low a gear, but I don't want to labour the motor and cause over heating of controller or motor.

 

[vfr400]

Quite new to the Pedelec thing, so pinch of salt needed maybe, but my BS01 is not that great at climbing hills, though I do have some monster hills to climb here with 800 foot climbs in a couple of miles. My partner who is 5 feet 1 and weighs about 9 stone easily catches me up on her Somerby on some of them and I am puffing like Stephenson's Rocket. I weigh a tad over twelve stone, so not a heavy lad. I hear her shout, 'Coming by', and she does. The Somerby is probably about the most basic 250 watt hub motor and control outfit there is.. Maybe I am running my BS01 in too low a gear, but I don't want to labour the motor and cause over heating of controller or motor.

On the surface, something doesn't sound right because they both have about the same power. Mass is an important factor. Your all up weights are approx 12st and 15st, so she has a 25% advantage over you if you both pedal as hard as each other. Assuming similar fitness, a 12st bloke should be able to pedal a lot harder than a 9st female, but pedal power is only about 30% of the total, so that would reduce her overall advantage to about 12%.

The Woosh kit makes about 50% more power than the Pendleton, so you'd blitz her on a hill.

 

[Nealh]

The BBS01 programming may be stock settings and very low esp the keep current.

 

[Steve J H]

Quite new to the Pedelec thing, so pinch of salt needed maybe, but my BS01 is not that great at climbing hills, though I do have some monster hills to climb here with 800 foot climbs in a couple of miles. My partner who is 5 feet 1 and weighs about 9 stone easily catches me up on her Somerby on some of them and I am puffing like Stephenson's Rocket. I weigh a tad over twelve stone, so not a heavy lad. I hear her shout, 'Coming by', and she does. The Somerby is probably about the most basic 250 watt hub motor and control outfit there is.. Maybe I am running my BS01 in too low a gear, but I don't want to labour the motor and cause over heating of controller or motor.

Quite new to the Pedelec thing, so pinch of salt needed maybe, but my BS01 is not that great at climbing hills, though I do have some monster hills to climb here with 800 foot climbs in a couple of miles. My partner who is 5 feet 1 and weighs about 9 stone easily catches me up on her Somerby on some of them and I am puffing like Stephenson's Rocket. I weigh a tad over twelve stone, so not a heavy lad. I hear her shout, 'Coming by', and she does. The Somerby is probably about the most basic 250 watt hub motor and control outfit there is.. Maybe I am running my BS01 in too low a gear, but I don't want to labour the motor and cause over heating of controller or motor.

Hi Tony
My BBS01 was underwhelming on stock programming. A few adjustments made a huge improvement to performance.

 

[Deleted member 16246]

Hi Tony
My BBS01 was underwhelming on stock programming. A few adjustments made a huge improvement to performance.

Yes - all the comments are noted. She is a lot younger than me, but I'm not a knacker either and she does run, which I don't now, though I used to. I am thinking that the seller may have changed the power through programming alterations. It came from Billy Milburn in Durham who I have mentioned before, and he may have fettled it to keep warranty issues low.

I'm quite happy about the way it works in general. At the moment I want good range and I do get that. If I put it on max PAS which is 5 in my case, I see the power consumption on hills sticking at about 500 - 600 watts on a steep climb. Throttle does the same, but I try not to give it such a hard time. Yesterday I did a big climb over a longish period and I just sat with it at level 2 and 3 of five and peddled along at 8 miles an hour. That'll do me. If I want to ride a motorbike, I have three in the garage. When I came to live here four years ago, I had no motorbikes. I brought two three speed bikes and soon got sick of walking up the hills. The motor bikes were a way of getting around the little lanes on a sunny day without getting into a sweat. Two out of the three were bought for the price of a Bafang and a good battery.

Thanks for the hints and tips. I might get one of those Bafang programming leads and take a look at what the thing is set on. Part of the issue may be my choice of gears. I deliberately avoid labouring the motor which I know is not good for some electric motors and possibly controllers. I can see on teh led that the power cuts down and goes off when I am spinning the cranks in bottom gear.

 

[Deleted member 16246]

I should maybe add - that my Bafang BBS01 is not speed limited and on the flat it romps along if in PAS mode 3,4 and 5. In 5 it is still pulling at 25miles an hour in top gear, which I quite like, though I keep an eye out for Mr P. I don't ride in high pas levels mostly.

 

[Nealh]

If the stock keep current is low and certainly <40%, the hill climbing ability will be impaired. My one I bought several years ago was only set to 20% , very frugal for riding range on flat terrain but felt terrible on inclines esp on the South Downs climbing.