Add more power

I want to change my bbs01b controller to 20amp . Has anyone tried this and it's still reliable. Currently it's 18amp

I was about to up my amps from 15, but I accidentally killed my controller while attempting something else (poor solderingskills - much improved since ), and then my programming cable stopped working (broken internal wire). But this makes me cautious, even though I now have a new controller - looks like a Bafang HD? We might never know what caused it, overloaded batteries?

 

https://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/e-bike-catches-fire.38180/

 

I don't know why I was considering more amps, because my BBS01b copes with everything I throw at it anyway... it's a tinkering fetish, and a habitual need for speed, which I no longer need or want. But I'd only get more power with more amps, and faster acceleration, less range, hotter battery and motor, shorter battery lifespan.

Edited December 12, 20214 yr by guerney

You need to consider if your battery is capable of delevering 20A without stress. It should be rated 25-30A maximum to do this.

You need to consider if your battery is capable of delevering 20A without stress. It should be rated 25-30A maximum to do this.

 

 

I have no idea what my batter is capable of. There's no continuous discharge rating on the battery, the seller said it contains LG cells. I asked the seller about how many amps it was rated for, and he claimed 25A. Now that the 1 year warranty has expired, I might open it up to have a good look. He suggested that the large number of cells in the battery made it capable of providing 25A continuously. It's the 19.2ah below (but it's been a year, and the battery I bought last year might contain different LG? cells)

 

Edited January 16, 20224 yr by guerney

For Guerney's battery they are MH1's as the only 3200mah cell LG produce.

 

Test of LG 18650 MH1 3200mAh (Cyan) (lygte-info.dk)

 

What the 6p bank of cells can deliver current wise depends on the BMS continuous discharge. With 6p the battery theoretically could discharge 60a but a safe good level is 30a.

For Guerney's battery they are MH1's as the only 3200mah cell LG produce.

 

Test of LG 18650 MH1 3200mAh (Cyan) (lygte-info.dk)

 

What the 6p bank of cells can deliver current wise depends on the BMS continuous discharge. With 6p the battery theoretically could discharge 60a but a safe good level is 30a.

 

 

Thank you nealh, that's very useful. I ordered a new programming cable rather than attempt repairing the one with the iffy broken internal cable, and am now very tempted to try out 20A! It's out of curiosity, not need - this bbs01b @15A tackles all the steep hills around here with no problems. But more amps might come in handy around harvest - end of October next year - when dragging around pumpkins on a trailer of some description, and greatly increased weight. If I can't find one of your excellent Carry Freedoms (cheers for the heads up!), I'll opt for a Homcom folding trailer - how bad could it be?

For Guerney's battery they are MH1's as the only 3200mah cell LG produce.

 

Test of LG 18650 MH1 3200mAh (Cyan) (lygte-info.dk)

 

What the 6p bank of cells can deliver current wise depends on the BMS continuous discharge. With 6p the battery theoretically could discharge 60a but a safe good level is 30a.

 

 

Now that the 1 year warranty has expired, I've opened the case and nealh - you're right! MH1 cells! Presumably I can safely set the controller to 20A??!?!?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Here's the BMS sticker:

 

 

 

 

 

There are marks within the battery case where the battery pack has been bouncing on it. I can hear it banging about, when bouncing over potholes:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I've added a couple of narrow strips of sponge, but there must be some better (but thin?) shock absorbing material? This is just the stuff left over from installing my halogen hob:

 

 

 

 

 

I can't work out what these marks are without removing the sticky dark green paper. Looks like oil or glue (there are wires underneath that part, could be glue), hope it's not leaky cells Where there's smoke, there's fire? It looks like oil or glue, and it's on the side of the pack near the BMS, not leaking out underneath.

 

 

Edited January 22, 20224 yr by guerney

Now that the 1 year warranty has expired, I've opened the case and nealh - you're right! MH1 cells! Presumably I can safely set the controller to 20A??!?!?

 

 

[ATTACH type=full" alt="45440]45440[/ATTACH]

 

 

 

[ATTACH type=full" alt="45445]45445[/ATTACH]

 

 

[ATTACH type=full" alt="45447]45447[/ATTACH]

 

 

 

Here's the BMS sticker:

 

 

[ATTACH type=full" alt="45441]45441[/ATTACH]

 

 

 

There are marks within the battery case where the battery pack has been bouncing on it. I can hear it banging about, when bouncing over potholes:

 

 

[ATTACH type=full" alt="45442]45442[/ATTACH]

 

 

[ATTACH type=full" alt="45443]45443[/ATTACH]

 

 

 

 

I've added a couple of narrow strips of sponge, but there must be some better (but thin?) shock absorbing material? This is just the stuff left over from installing my halogen hob:

 

 

[ATTACH type=full" alt="45444]45444[/ATTACH]

 

 

 

I can't work out what these marks are without removing the sticky dark green paper. Looks like oil or glue (there are wires underneath that part, could be glue), hope it's not leaky cells Where there's smoke, there's fire? It looks like oil or glue, and it's on the side of the pack near the BMS, not leaking out underneath.

 

 

[ATTACH type=full" alt="45446]45446[/ATTACH]

Which supplier was your battery from?

Which supplier was your battery from?

 

It was part of a bbs01b kit bought from IEBIKE via Amazon. They don't usually have any stock in the UK, but sometimes they do. Diagnostics are carried out on faulty items in China.

Edited January 22, 20224 yr by guerney

The BMS looks like it is 22a continuous so one could go 20a if the programming allows.

The stains I would lift the paper insulation covering to look, does it smell of electrolyte ?

The BMS looks like it is 22a continuous so one could go 20a if the programming allows.

The stains I would lift the paper insulation covering to look, does it smell of electrolyte ?

 

This battery has always smelled of something, which could be electrolyte. The smell was much stronger when I opened the battery case. But voltage and performance were good, fully charged voltage is lower than last year. What is the function of the green sticky paper? It doesn't look particularly strong - if I peel it away, what could I replace it with? Gaffa tape?

The paper is an insulator /protector and is quite hard wearing.

Re use the paper if poss and use a wrap or two of kapton tape to bind it again.

Once lifted it depends what the cells look like and whether leaking has occurred, leaking will show up as the cell wrap will be bubbly/rough. Electrolyte smell I can't describe but any smell is abnormal as cells don't smell.

The paper is an insulator /protector and is quite hard wearing.

Re use the paper if poss and use a wrap or two of kapton tape to bind it again.

Once lifted it depends what the cells look like and whether leaking has occurred, leaking will show up as the cell wrap will be bubbly/rough. Electrolyte smell I can't describe but any smell is abnormal as cells don't smell.

 

This battery has always smelled of something, does remind me of a puffy laptop battery, but it performs ok (I think).

 

If you look at the photo below, the two marks follow shape of the wires 1 and 2 exactly - I think the heat from those wires (transferred from cells beneath?) has broken down the tacky but not permanent adhesive which covers this paper. It removed fairly easily and re-stuck well. No cells look puffy, nothing is leaking. The cell pack isn't deformed. I'm wondering if the smell is from the paper adhesive breaking down with heat or something?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This foam left over from installing my halogen hob is supposed to be slippy (designed to allow the glass of the hob to slide over, as it expands and shrinks with changing temperature. Lots of cowboy builders stick those hobs down with silicone glue, which causes the hob to crack lol) and tolerate high temperatures, so I've used what I had left to add some more padding - must get more for the top interior of the casing, to further prevent these banging noises over potholes coming from the battery... unless someone suggests a better foam to use.

 

 

Edited January 22, 20224 yr by guerney

The paper is an insulator /protector and is quite hard wearing.

Re use the paper if poss and use a wrap or two of kapton tape to bind it again.

Once lifted it depends what the cells look like and whether leaking has occurred, leaking will show up as the cell wrap will be bubbly/rough. Electrolyte smell I can't describe but any smell is abnormal as cells don't smell.

 

Kapton - That's what's used for the James Webb telescope heat shields:

 

https://www.theregister.com/2022/01/21/jwst/

 

I'll get some:

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Youmile-Temperature-Resistant-Polyimide-Resisting-Width-50mm/dp/B07QGMDFSH/ref=

The paper is an insulator /protector and is quite hard wearing.

Re use the paper if poss and use a wrap or two of kapton tape to bind it again.

Once lifted it depends what the cells look like and whether leaking has occurred, leaking will show up as the cell wrap will be bubbly/rough. Electrolyte smell I can't describe but any smell is abnormal as cells don't smell.

 

If this battery pack contains puffy cells causing a smell, are there any electrical tests I could do? Like I said, it performs ok. I haven't charged it for awhile, but will report back with it's fully charged voltage.

The paper is an insulator /protector and is quite hard wearing.

Re use the paper if poss and use a wrap or two of kapton tape to bind it again.

Once lifted it depends what the cells look like and whether leaking has occurred, leaking will show up as the cell wrap will be bubbly/rough. Electrolyte smell I can't describe but any smell is abnormal as cells don't smell.

 

This battery was as stinky when I bought it, but it's managed over a year of much use. It's puzzling that it smells, but surely a cell would have popped and caused an explosion or fire by now, if whatever this smell is, was indicative of a battery problem?

The paper is an insulator /protector and is quite hard wearing.

Re use the paper if poss and use a wrap or two of kapton tape to bind it again.

Once lifted it depends what the cells look like and whether leaking has occurred, leaking will show up as the cell wrap will be bubbly/rough. Electrolyte smell I can't describe but any smell is abnormal as cells don't smell.

 

Will this paper cope with increased heat of 20A? The adhesive of the paper seems to be breaking down above hot wires... Maybe I should just replace it all with Kapton tape?

Bit late to the party, but I hope I can provide some useful information. Forum peeps have probably heard me mention this before, but I believe it's quite an important programming change, to give the BBS series a bit more oomph.

 

This only applies to PAS! So if you feel it's lacking somewhat in hill climbing abilities, or just a general lack of torque when pedalling, then change the following setting.

 

Go to the 'Keep Current' box on the 'Pedal Assist' page. Change it to a higher value than the one present. If it's at 100%, then it's maxed already, but if it's a lower value, then change the value to a higher figure. No need to max out, but a good idea is to increase in increments of 10%, until you achieve the results you want.

 

Basically, this feature drops the supplied amps to the percentage in the box, once the bike is being pedalled at a certain speed. This is great for flat terrain and improves overall battery economy. The problem is when you are pedalling uphill, where the controller will drop available amps and hence reducing torque. The opposite of what you need when traversing steep terrain.

 

I've known forum members receiving controllers with the 'Keep Current' set to 10%, which is no use to man or beast on an electric bike.

 

Obviously, depending on the controllers other settings, results in how well changing the 'Keep Current' will effect the riding performance. If you are generally happy with everything else, but just need some extra oomph in PAS, then this is the setting to change.

Bit late to the party, but I hope I can provide some useful information. Forum peeps have probably heard me mention this before, but I believe it's quite an important programming change, to give the BBS series a bit more oomph.

 

This only applies to PAS! So if you feel it's lacking somewhat in hill climbing abilities, or just a general lack of torque when pedalling, then change the following setting.

 

Go to the 'Keep Current' box on the 'Pedal Assist' page. Change it to a higher value than the one present. If it's at 100%, then it's maxed already, but if it's a lower value, then change the value to a higher figure. No need to max out, but a good idea is to increase in increments of 10%, until you achieve the results you want.

 

Basically, this feature drops the supplied amps to the percentage in the box, once the bike is being pedalled at a certain speed. This is great for flat terrain and improves overall battery economy. The problem is when you are pedalling uphill, where the controller will drop available amps and hence reducing torque. The opposite of what you need when traversing steep terrain.

 

I've known forum members receiving controllers with the 'Keep Current' set to 10%, which is no use to man or beast on an electric bike.

 

Obviously, depending on the controllers other settings, results in how well changing the 'Keep Current' will effect the riding performance. If you are generally happy with everything else, but just need some extra oomph in PAS, then this is the setting to change.

 

 

I totally agree!

 

An odd error popped up when changing the "Current Limit" from 15 to 20... "Speed Meter Signals" kept defaulting to 36, and the "Speed Meter Type" changed, which produced the error "Out of range", and the "Current Limit" set itself to 1. Reading the firmware confirmed these odd settings, and it wouldn't write the settings I wanted. But after disconnecting and shutting down the Penoff's Config tool, switching the battery off, disconnecting the cable, then switching the battery back on, connecting the cable and then starting and connecting the software, then reading the firmware, setting "Speed Meter Signals" back to 1, and setting "Speed Meter Type" back to "External, Wheel Meter" again... it's now a 20A bbs01b! Will it explode the battery when I try it later on? If it's ill. It's too cold to try just now.

 

 

 

 

Edited January 22, 20224 yr by guerney

Maybe I should set the controller to 19A, because I have 0.68A in lights soldered to the battery?

Well, the display turns on, testing PAS seems to work when the bike is suspended from the ceiling. The lights all switch on to full brightness... but I'll change the "Current Limit" to 19A before I venture out, when it's a bit warmer. There should be a "Fingers crossed" emoji.

It's now a 20A bbs01b! Will it explode the battery when I try it later on? If it's ill. It's too cold to try just now.

Although better than controllers of old, the latest BBS controllers are still capable of undershooting or overshooting their set values. Setting a 15A limit could still draw 16 or more amps from the battery in certain conditions, same as it may fall short and only produce 14 amps in certain conditions. For your peace of mind, they certainly don't overshoot enough to be sitting on a potential bomb, but prolonged excessive amp draw beyond the battery's capability, will shorten its life.

 

I made the mistake of purchasing my first battery with Samsung 29E cells in a 13S4P layout.

After maxing my controller settings, it didn't last very long. Less than 2 years IIRC.

 

I switched to a pack with LG HG2 cells in a 13S5P layout. This has been far better suited to my BBS02, which can peak at 25 or more amps for extended periods of time.

 

At the end of the day, don't worry about it. If the battery is poorly, you'll have problems no matter how you program the controller. Then it's time for a new one, unless yer handy (and brave) at replacing cells

Although better than controllers of old, the latest BBS controllers are still capable of undershooting or overshooting their set values. Setting a 15A limit could still draw 16 or more amps from the battery in certain conditions, same as it may fall short and only produce 14 amps in certain conditions. For your peace of mind, they certainly don't overshoot enough to be sitting on a potential bomb, but prolonged excessive amp draw beyond the battery's capability, will shorten its life.

 

I made the mistake of purchasing my first battery with Samsung 29E cells in a 13S4P layout.

After maxing my controller settings, it didn't last very long. Less than 2 years IIRC.

 

I switched to a pack with LG HG2 cells in a 13S5P layout. This has been far better suited to my BBS02, which can peak at 25 or more amps for extended periods of time.

 

At the end of the day, don't worry about it. If the battery is poorly, you'll have problems no matter how you program the controller. Then it's time for a new one, unless yer handy (and brave) at replacing cells

 

 

That's good to know about the current draw of BBS controllers! I might try it out for an hour or so, to see if a Bafang bbs01b drawing about 19A is what I want - but quite honestly I don't really need all that power anyway. It copes fine at 15A, even when carrying very heavy loads uphill. After zooming up a steep hill or three, I plan to set it back to 15A. If I must have 19A, I'll bear that in mind when purchasing my next battery. I can't see my present battery exhibiting any signs of ill health, it has a worrying odour, but in all other respects it's been fine. It smelt like this when it arrived last year brand new. I can't imagine that a failing battery would have coped with being charged up every other day and powering the bike for over 1400 miles (so far).

Edited January 22, 20224 yr by guerney

Is there some sort of battery wrap material available which is heat conductive, but electrically insulating?

I made the mistake of purchasing my first battery with Samsung 29E cells in a 13S4P layout.

After maxing my controller settings, it didn't last very long. Less than 2 years IIRC.

 

That surprises me, I thought Samsung cells were the best? But I don't know much about ebike batteries...