36v 1000w sine wave controller and display

[eHomer]

After the success of upgrading to sine wave controller on my 36v 250watt hall effect bike, I was wondering if I could upgrade my other bike, and if it would reduce noise levels on that ?

This one is a non-geared direct drive 1000watt 48v hall effect motor running at 36v.

I got some very helpful advice from this forum a few months back on how to modify the 48v controller to lower the cutoff voltage so that it would work on a 36v lithium battery pack. That's all working fine with my two 36v 10ah lithium ion battery packs.

I wanted to use the 36v rather than 48v because I already had those packs, and the motor's plenty fast enough for me at about 22mph running at (I guess) an effective power of 750 watts.

I looked on the BMS website for sinewave controllers but they didn't seem to go up to that power rating. Is there a high power 36v sine wave controller available anywhere, preferably with one of the nice new digital display/controller panels like the one I got for my 250w motor ?

I'm assuming the sine wave controller will be even quieter than the standard controller on this ungeared motor ?

Sorry about all of this waffle, I tried to keep it to the point !

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Don't worry too much about the power rating of the motor. many people tend to run those motors at 48v and 25 amps. The BMSBattery controller is 23 amp, so at 48v, you wouldn't be losing much, although I think it might be a bit low at 36v. You might be able to solder the shunt for a bit more, but those direct drive motors take a constant high current, which could overheat a hot-rodded controller unless it gets a good stream of air.

 

[eHomer]

Thanks for the quick reply again Dave.

If I understand correctly, you're saying that the same BMS sine wave controller and panel that I bought for my 36v 250 watt bike would work on the 48v 1000 watt motor ?

Though with the caveat that it would run much hotter ?

I must admit, by comparison, the square wave controller that came with the 1000w motor is physically more than twice as big as the 36v sine wave controller.

I notice that BMS do advertise a 500w controller, the S12S, ( where the SO6S that I previously bought was 250w).

The spec shows:

1. For 36V and 48V batteries;
2. It fits all S series LCD and LED meters.
3. For 500Watts hall sensor motors.
4. Sine Wave.
5. Dimension: 38x66x140mm

The SO6S controller was 31x51x86mm, so it is quite a bit bigger, though still not as big as the current non-sine wave 1000w controller.

Do you think the S12S would work ok with my 48v 1000w hall effect motor running at 36v on 36v batteries ? Would that be much less "hot-rodded" and therefore cooler ?

If so, I'm now thinking as a BMS shopping list:

S12S sine wave controller - $34
S-LCD1 E-Bike LCD Meter - $26
Eight poles PAS--Pulse Pedal Assistant Sensor - $1.90
Speed Sensor - $1.90

(plus postage)

Do you think that 500W controller would work unmodified with my motor, and without overheating ?

 

[Deleted member 4366]

No. You've misunderstood. I was only talking about the S012S controller that would be OK at 48v, but a bit weak at 36v. There's no way the S06S could work that motor other than to test that it spins.

 

[eHomer]

Blast ! I thought I had it there...

OK, change of tack then.

Aside from the sine wave upgrade, my other motive for upgrading the controller on my 1000w(750w) motor was to get adjustable PAS.

At the moment, the controller that came with the motor does have a pas sensor, but no provision for control panel. So when it's connected it seems to just go full power and then it's hard to keep up with the pedaling and consumes max current.

I'm very please with the BMS S-LCD1 E-Bike LCD Meter on my 250w bike, and the variable 1-5 PAS works well on that.

So, how about I drop the sine wave ambition, and go for the BMS S12P 750W Torque Simulation Square Wave Controller ?

As I understand it, that will enable my 1000w 48v hall effect direct motor to be used with 36v batteries and the S-LCD1 control panel, and give me controllable PAS ?

As it's rated at 750w at 36v, am I right thinking that's a perfect power match for my 48v 1000w motor used at 36 volts ?

Lastly, , do you think the torque simulation would be good in this situation ?

I like using the bike at the moment at about 18 mph, with pedal assistance, more on the hills. At the moment that is achieved somewhat awkwardly by constantly adjusting the manual throttle to get the balance. I was hoping the control panel and setable PAS would make it auto, as on my 250w bike ?

 

[eHomer]

Damn...

I've just seen a flaw in my proposal I think.

That controller is for "sensorless" motors, and my 1000w direct hub motor is hall effect, with 8 connections.

The diagram for the controller on the BMS site shows only the three main motor connections.

I assume that's no good for my motor then ?

If so, any ideas for using BMS products to get adjustable PAS with their LCD panel with my motor at 36v without straining anything ?

 

[Deleted member 4366]

The ones from Conhismotor will work. I have one on my GNG. It gives about 30 amps. The display doesn't give correct speed and distance with a geared motor, but it'll be fine with a DD motor.
http://www.conhismotor.com/ProductShow.asp?id=323

 

[eHomer]

Thanks.

What are Conhismotor like for ordering ?

I'm nervous about direct buying from abroad without Ebay buyer protection.

I have to admit that BMS were excellent though, delivery was within two weeks, much better than the usual 6 or 7 from China.

I've looked on Conhismotor's website and can see the price, but no information on shipping prices ?

Yes, a perfect match at 36v 750w and the five levels of PAS.

Presumably it's square wave ? I was trying to see the hall sensor connections in the photo, and therer's no mention of sensor or sensorless in the spec.

Where you've said "The display doesn't give correct speed and distance with a geared motor" does that mean it takes the signal from the motor, rather than a magnetic pickup from the wheel ?

They don't mention a PAS pedal sensor, would it take the signal from a standard one ?

 

[Scimitar]

Thanks.

What are Conhismotor like for ordering ?

Fine - they supplied my motor and controller. The usual slow-boat delivery, but no problems.
I was hoping their 'new controllers' would be sine-wave, but no mention of that; it seems to simply refer to the integrated LCD panel.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

I've ordered twice. A couple of weeks each time.

 

[eHomer]

Thanks for the feedback on them, (Scimitar & D8veh).

As you say, it would have been a bonus if it was sine wave, but the lcd controller and the adjustable PAS is worth it for me.

I dug around their website a bit more, and found that the controller does have hall effect wires, so it should work with my motor.

They state 7-14 days to "major destinations", so hopefully that includes the UK !

Now ordered, £77 with the postage.

I'll put feedback on here when it arrives and I fit it.

Thanks again for the help...

 

[eHomer]

I've had a confirmation of payment completed from Paypal, but have had no emails from Conhismotor, and they haven't replied to my email asking them to confirm the order.

Is that normal for them ?

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Completely normal. Neither can you find it in their order tracing system, The first you'll know is when it arrives on your doorstep after about 10 days.

They did give me an explanation - something about the way you're logged on when you place the order.

 

[eHomer]

Thanks for the reassurance Dave.

Nice to know how others have faired.

On a similar vein I just received delivery of a set of Avid BB5 cable disc brakes today, ordered via Ebay from another seller.

They were listed as coming from Rotterdam, but it's some sort of half-way arrangement with a Chinese supplier.

No indication of them being dispatched, and yet they came within thirteen days, quite fast.

Amazing value, front and back BB5, with 160mm rotors, for £19.95, inc postage.

 

[eHomer]

They've just responded to my email and confirmed the order.

Excellent....

 

[eHomer]

Update - The controller and display arrived yesterday, six days after the order was placed.

I was a little nervous of going direct to a non-Ebay vendor, with seemingly less safeguards if anything went wrong, but their service has been excellent, the fastest I've ever had from China.

Thanks for the advice from this forum to try them, I doubt if I would have otherwise.

I'll put another update on here when I've fitted it to the bike.