2006 Giant Twist Comfort GTS Range Question

[JohnInStockie]

Hello All

Can anyone advise on the range of this bike (owners and general comments welcome). I have one, and am doing a 11 mile each way comute to work over a mixture of roads and off-road cycle paths.

I am having to recharge EACH WAY!

On the way into work, I arrive normally with 2 lights remaining on the battery, but on the return trip (having fully recharged it at work), it always gets down the the point of flashing, and additionally without some significant contributions from me,

Is This Right??


I am not the lightest person in the world, coming in at 16.5 stone (roughly 110kgs?), and I have 2 Ortlieb panniers and carry approximately 4Kgs with me, and I know that the bike was designed for someone of 75Kgs.

I am 39 yrs old, overwieght, but only moderately unfit (as in I have no known disablilities apart from my weight, and can happily move furniture/put concrete fenching in my garden recently).

I arrive at work in the morning sweating, and its taking me 55 minutes to cover the 11 miles. On the way home I give it a lot of energy and arrive covered in sweat, yet its still taking me just over an hour (it is uphill generally though).

Reading everyone elses comment and times, and what A to B say about their 10 mile commuter track (which they do in about 40 mins) , Is it because of my weight that I am not seeing the speed and distance that everyone else seems to get from the Giant?

What do others think? Do I have a battery Problem? Motor Problem? Fitness issue?

I would like others to advise me as I dont know if its me or the bike (or both)?

Thanks for any feedback

John:confused

 

[Leonardo]

May be weight is the problem. I have the same bicycle and I feel quite confident of a 20 miles range. But I’ve noticed a sharp reduction of range while going uphill with my 6 years old son on the child seat, what brings the weight on my bicycle at the same level of yours.

I don’t know how long you own your bicycle John. In my experience (not so long: one year) my ability to use the bicycle at its best is improved - as well as my fitness may be. While in the beginning I did sweat in the last part of my way back home, a 2 miles 5-10% climb, now it doesn’t almost happen any more (at least when sun is not to hot!). I had to learn not to dress myself in a too warm way, to get the right rhythm in my pedalling in order to find the lightest point, etc. etc.

In any case your commute is longer than mine. I don’t need to recharge battery in the same day usually, but if this happens I pay attention not to recharge it while it is still warm and also, when it is possible, to let it get cold again before using.

 

[Baboonking]

Range veries so much with terrain/ weight and riding style that its impossible to guestimate for sure. If you want to find out for sure then a battery meter such as the 'watts up' or 'drainbrain' (google them for more info) will let you know exactly whats going on.

my guess is there's nothing wrong with your battery. the twist pack is pretty small at only 168 watt hours(24volts x 7ah). you might want to try installing a second battery pack (see grandads posts) or buying a single larger 24 volt pack (see ebikes.ca and look at purchase) you could probably use your standard giant charger.

 

[JohnInStockie]

Thank you very much for your posts there, you have both given me food for thought. Can I ask though, is there a way you should "ride a twist". Is there a specific riding style that I need to adopt?

I generally tend to ride as if I were on a standard racer, which was how I learnt to ride as a child, which basically means, "go as fast as you can!". So you can see how disappointed I am to be going so slowly (avg 11-13 mph when trying my hardest)

Again any views are appreciated.

John

 

[flecc]

I'm sure it is the weight John, which you've informed me of before.

The Twist in it's optimum 3 speed original form returned about 20 miles range for A to B magazine testers, and I found exactly the same when I bought mine. After changing to the SRAM 5 speed that dropped to 17 miles on a new battery, the changes in gearing showing that Giant had it near perfect first time, but with hill climb limitations.

But at that time I was 10 stone 5 lbs (66 kilos) so you are 50% heavier than I was then, and that will bring an appreciable loss of range.

There's also the battery factor. You bought your bike very late in it's life after discontinuation, and it had been in stock for a while. I remember you also had some questions about the battery's condition at the time. It may be therefore that the battery is down on it's original capacity. Recelling with the Powacycle cells would increase it's capacity from the original design point of 6.5 Ah to 8 Ah, and a replacement Giant item is now 9 Ah, even more. These would give the proportional increase in range.

You won't change the range appreciably through riding techniques since the software controls that aspect efficiently anyway. The only way the rider can help is in riding with the power switched off when conditions suit, something I routinely do.
.

 

[Flying Kiwi]

Twist Comfort Gents Range

Also being the owner of a 2006 Giant Twist Comfort Gents and weighing about 110 kg (and also aged 39) I get about 18 miles or so from a full charge until the motor cuts out with a flashing red handlebar switch light. I used to commute about 6 miles each way to work including a very steep hill but no longer work for that company so now only use my bike from time to time, depending where I'm working on the day. I found when I was commuting as above I couldn't get 2 days travel from it as it would run out part way into the return on the second day (fortunately the steep hill was down hill going that way).

I recently managed to obtain an old Giant Twist Battery which the elderly gentleman owner said I could have as he'd bought a replacement (I gave him £10 for taking the trouble of bringing it into town where I was working the next day). Although it was scratched and in a shabby state, I've put the internals into my spare brand new battery case and charged it up. I was anticipating it wouldn't hold any charge as no lights had illuminated at all when I received it. Yesterday I did about 9 miles on it and found it still had 3 red lights left - not bad for £10 So now when I really need to cover a distance over 18 miles or so, I can take this along too for a replacement on-route. When the blip in NiMH cell prices subsides, I may look to re-cell it (possibly even with the new Lithium Ion Polymer battery internals as on the Windsor etc) but this wont be necessesary for some time yet.

If you're not lucky enough to aquire a spare battery this way (Presteigne may be a good place to look around next weekend for the electric bike rally - there were lots of Twists there last year) then I can understand if you're reluctant to pay the ludicrous price of a new one. Grandads way looks like a cheap and cheerful means of accomplishing a reserve supply. You only need pay for what you use, the generic batteries themselves rather than the proprietary case as well.

 

[Baboonking]

I generally tend to ride as if I were on a standard racer, which was how I learnt to ride as a child, which basically means, "go as fast as you can!"
John

sounds good to me

The other efficiency tip is to use the gears as much as possilbe as the motor is more efficient when it spins faster. By the sounds of it your going to get very fit very fast with a commute like that.

 

[Grandad]

Hello everybody
I thought my ears were burning.
When using my Twist Lite I was getting around 18 miles from a charge with the original Giant battery if I had it switched on all the time. I bought a second battery from Giant as I was told that it was a 8Ah. It arrived labelled 6.5Ah. I queried this and was informed that the label was incorrect!

So I tested the battery on the same run and got 12 miles, improving to 15 miles/charge after a few runs. It then dropped to 8 miles so I contaced my supplier who in turn was concerned and contacted Giant. Their reply was that they had given incorrect information as they only stocked (at that time) 6.5 Ah batteries.

My supplier offered to take back the battery or supply another 6.5Ah version, so I sent back the battery and recieved a refund.

I then came across flecc's idea of using Salibury battery cells and placed an order. As my original Giant battery was still ok I decided on my modification.

After a few charge/discharge cycles I am now getting 24 miles/charge so thanks flecc.

At the moment I am finding the time to finalise the mod, avoiding modifying the battery. The delay was due to obtaining American 2 pin plugs to connect to the battery. I wanted to ensure that the plug could not cause reverse polarity so I have come up with these two versions (above).
The first way is to wire up one terminal on each of two plugs and screw then together. If the plug is inserted incorrectly it just doesn't work.
The second, more complicated way, is the modify a plug case to re-align the terminal blades through 90 deg. A tab is attached to the outside casing to prevent incorrect insertion.
Both methods work well. My site will be updated soon.

Sorry to go on & on
jeff

 

[flecc]

Not going on at all Jeff, another very well executed mod like your previous ones. Those Powacycle batteries are a real bargain now in today's high price NiMh market, long may that continue.

 

[Leonardo]

What do you think of this kind of system providing battery + racks: could it be a good option for a “grandad’s style” second battery?

eBay Item number: 110122028029

8.5 nimh battery (4 kgs) + charger + racks cost around 150 pounds including shipping

 

[Grandad]

What do you think of this kind of system providing battery + racks: could it be a good option for a “grandad’s style” second battery?

eBay Item number: 110122028029
8.5 nimh battery (4 kgs) + charger + racks cost around 150 pounds including shipping

That looks neat and professional to me. The matching pannier bags look good too.
It would also save a lot of time and effort using this item.

The only drawback I can see is that the centre of gravity would be high. Cheers
Jeff

 

[Leonardo]

Unfortunately I have no technical skills, and being very impressed by your idea Jeff I looked for something that may be possible for me… the system is part of a hub motor kit of the same kind of the one used by the (Chinese) bicycles sold by this Austrian eBay seller… However, beside of the problem of the center of gravity, I'm not sure of the quality of the batteries.

 

[JohnInStockie]

Range problem

Unfortunately, I think its like Flecc said.

BIGGER WEIGHT + OLDER bATTERIES = SHORTER RANGE

I am tempted to buy the 9Ah Battery and a spare charger from Nycewheels, but the £500 bill is a bit scary just now.

I could look at re-celling like Flecc, or adding a second like Grandad, but both of those methods involve the clear and real risk of destroying my bike, so for a mere mortal like me, I would have to rule them out.

I think its Muesli for breakfast then

Any ideas anyone . . . .

 

[Ian]

Any ideas anyone . . . .

Looks like theres a potential business oportunity for an enterprising technically capable person re-celling e-bike batteries.
Not me though, these days I'm looking for less work rather than more.

 

[flecc]

Yes John.

Although Cellpack Solutions made a mess of things seemingly and were unable to recell the Giant battery successfully as I've done and will no longer try it, Vita Electric in London do offer a service.

Ring them and ask for a quote and details on 020 7794 3373.

 

[JohnInStockie]

Flecc, your a star. Thanks for that.