Well, I have just gone and done it - Kalkhoff BS10 ordered today

flapajack

Pedelecer
Aug 4, 2013
114
33
Hi everyone

After several months of research and (it feels like) even longer period of deliberating, I have finally gone and placed an order for a Kalkhoff BS10. Hopefully, it will arrive by the end of the month once the Cyclescheme CTW voucher comes through. What I thought it would be useful is to share my journey to my decision - which is suspect there may be many on the same journey as me.

I started with limiting my budget to the limit of the CTW scheme - so £1000. This should, in all probability, give me some good choices for what I expect would be a commuting tool since I do not want to leave an expensive pice of equipment at work - even though the parking facility is secured and CCTV monitored. I also ride a bike to work most day is possible so well versed with the process.

A few obvious choices were Woosh, Burisch and that Taiwan Mosso which I was quite partial to. Unfortunately, all these suppliers do not accept Cyclescheme voucher which was quite a surprise at first, but understandable when you think about it. The Spencer was also a strong contender especially with the discount after the new year but unfortunately this failed since they decided to raise the prices at the last minute once I were just about in position to placed the order - a real disappointment and probably a good thing since I would hate to have to deal with this ongoing if I we to have any issues post purchase, especially given the outdated technology involved.

After some real soul-searching and some rides to work, I decided that I definitely do what to commute more since after only 2 trips I already feel so much better (fitter and happier and can replaced some of my gym sessions). I decided to try something more up-market and my initial choices we're the Kalkhoff BS10, ProConnect Impulse 10G-XT (my preferred choice on paper), ProcConnect Impulse 8G Alfine and possibly the ProConnect X24 Xion hub-drive. The last was a last-minute addition since I was quite partial to the idea of crank-drive in all my research.

Last Saturday I spent several hours at the Kingston 50 Cycles store trying out the various models. James at 50c was very helpful and patience and gave me all the time in the world to work through my thought and preferences, taking each bike out for 20/30 minutes at a time back-to-back to get a really good feel of the various bikes. The were some surprises.

First of all, I was very surprised that didn't like the PC Impulse 8G-Alfine as much as I would have expected, given the new Impulse 2 motor and quality components. It was more "noisy" than I thought relative to the others and the Alfine gears was really not for me - it is ok for bimbling but doesn't quite feel "responsive" enough for a proper spirited ride. I discounted the deraileurs Impulse 10G-XT for the same reason without trying it, given it has the same engine.

The ProConnect X24 was a real surprise o the day for me. The Xion hub-drive feel a lot more "natural" than I had expected (in theory and on paper since I have not had any rides up until then) and did have a not of go. Infant it responded better than the crank drive Impulse 2 motor, which was an eye-opener. James also mentioned that many seasoned riders actually prefer the X24 too since it provides the best riding experience of all the models available - and was a real bargain at the price (£1500 at time of writing and if you are quick). I also tried out the X27 (bigger battery, Betty gear and brakes, etc) but felt it was the same, but for considerably more money.

I then tried the BS10 and to my surprise (but probably not for many of you) it was a real revelation. It rides brilliantly and naturally and was brilliantly balanced. You can get to speed very quickly and it doesn't top-out like the others and therefore feels much more natural. Admittedly I did get to speed of 20+ mph but the difference with the road-leg alone was only noticeable when you look at the speedo (at 15/16mph it already feel reasonable pace) and I would probably prefer to ride in Eco mode anyway for the extended range but I would pay for the option to get home quickly if needed. For those who would want to jump on the post pointing out this and that, yes is am perfectly aware of what it is and I am perfectly sensible enough to recognise when it is and is not suitable to ride fast than 15mph. I rode a 1100cc motorcycle and have been a motorcyclist for over 20+ years so am well aware of hazards and am speed sensible.

The final choice came to either the X24 or the BS10 - and there was quite a price difference to take into account too. I would have been very happy with the X24 but, recognising that I have a 18miles commute each way the ability to get home quickly when needed (eg in an emergency) was a real clincher for me. As a result, a BS10 is sitting comfortably in Loughborough with my name on it - can't wait, I am so excited!

For those who are undergoing the same journey, the persistent advice I hear from many knowledgable members on this forum is to try out as many bikes as you can (if possible) is absolutely true. I know that it isn't always possible but a lot of the suppliers have network of satisfied owners who are willing to let you have a go before deciding so make the best use of that. What is on paper may not work out in real life, even if it reads as "the best".

For those who cannot try out many models and have the budget, the Kalkhoff ProConnect X24 is a very good bike very much suited to seasoned riders and one I would recommend.

Maybe I can do a more thorough review of the BS10 when it arrives in a few weeks.

PS I have nothing to do with 50 Cycles, in case someone worry about my partiality.
 

Ronnyuk

Pedelecer
Mar 3, 2014
95
17
51
Bristol
ronny.ws
Hi Flapjack, Congratulations ordering your new E-Bike :p

Most online retailers will ship the bike to a C2W supplier if you ask them nicely :) It will obviously cost more then the online price but at least you can get what you want.. I think we spoke in the Burisch thread earlier...My Battery went funny after only 5 days of riding it but it is with them now being sorted, would be nice to hear how your new bike goes :)

I miss my bike :(
 
Last edited:
this is not a loaded question... I'm genuinely interested in the answer.

How do you feel about the fact its not UK road legal, and if caught using it on the road the bike could be crushed?

I'm guessing 50cycles told you about this problem with the 350w bikes that are available, so I'm just interesting in the thought process that made you comfortable with the purchase.

They are a growing number of people who seem prepared to ride illegal bikes on the UK roads.

Regards
Col.
 
  • Like
Reactions: tillson

Jonah

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 23, 2010
882
246
EX38
I'm sure you'll be very happy with the BS10.

As you reported, I have found that many people like the more sporty feel of the X24 (Xion hub), I think this is at least partly to do with the derailleur gears feeling more sporty than the hub gears (and the hub gears being rather too lowly geared for riding above 17mph). It would have been interesting to see if the 10G-XT felt as leisurely as the 8G-Alfine.

Also, I believe the Impulse 2 motor is configurable and has a number of parameters that can be set to alter the responsiveness of the torque sensor and power delivery - hence make it behave sportier. It would be interesting to try these out and see how they compare with the Impulse 1 motor. Even the Impulse 1 motor could be configured in 3 different modes that made a huge difference to the sportiness of the ride. I wonder how it was set up for your test ride.
 

Mr O

Finding my (electric) wheels
Mar 10, 2014
7
1
51
Hi flapajack
Glad it's not just me struggling to make a decision. I too started looking at sub £1000 bikes such as RooDog Avatar and Woosh Big Bear but am now torn between the X24 (thanks for the mini review!) and the Wisper 905, my current dilemna (and there have been several) being do I want a throttle or not.
Glad you are happy with your purchase, hoping to make my mind up soon before I go mad!
John
 

Jonah

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 23, 2010
882
246
EX38
Both X24 and Wisper are great bikes (I have both). The X24 is much sportier feeling but in this version less range. Having said that I find 40 real life miles (hilly rides) is quite achievable on the XT. Have you had a chance to ride either or both?
 

SRS

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 30, 2012
847
347
South Coast
this is not a loaded question... I'm genuinely interested in the answer.

How do you feel about the fact its not UK road legal, and if caught using it on the road the bike could be crushed?

I'm guessing 50cycles told you about this problem with the 350w bikes that are available, so I'm just interesting in the thought process that made you comfortable with the purchase.

They are a growing number of people who seem prepared to ride illegal bikes on the UK roads.

Regards
Col.
Col, if I met you in person, do you think you would wind me me up as much as most of your posts do?

If you could use all of your negative energy to actually sell KTM's, you would do very well.

I hope flapajack enjoys his new purchase. For his requirements it will be a brilliant machine.
 

Mr O

Finding my (electric) wheels
Mar 10, 2014
7
1
51
Thanks Jonah
Not tested either, unfortunately no dealers close. I'm in a flat coastal area but with a stiff sea breeze and 18 stones to shift my 6 feet 2 frame I need a bike with a bit of umph. I'm sure I would be happy with either, just never considered spending this much on a bike before!!
 
Hi SRS

Ok, ill word my post slightly differently.

We're looking at the uk market and how it's going to progress over the next couple of years. People are clearly happy to buy these illegal bikes, so I was asking about the thought process, because we are genuinely interested.

Should we be selling them??

Hope that's a little more positive.

Col
 

RobF

Esteemed Pedelecer
Sep 22, 2012
4,732
2,312
Hi SRS

Ok, ill word my post slightly differently.

We're looking at the uk market and how it's going to progress over the next couple of years. People are clearly happy to buy these illegal bikes, so I was asking about the thought process, because we are genuinely interested.

Should we be selling them??

Hope that's a little more positive.

Col
 

Kudoscycles

Official Trade Member
Apr 15, 2011
5,566
5,048
www.kudoscycles.com
this is not a loaded question... I'm genuinely interested in the answer.

How do you feel about the fact its not UK road legal, and if caught using it on the road the bike could be crushed?

I'm guessing 50cycles told you about this problem with the 350w bikes that are available, so I'm just interesting in the thought process that made you comfortable with the purchase.

They are a growing number of people who seem prepared to ride illegal bikes on the UK roads.

Regards
Col.
Colin....You are relatively a new contributor on this forum,you will soon realise you are on dangerous ground pointing out that this bike is illegal for cycle use in the UK on the Pedelecs forum. I did involve the Dept of Trading standards but they don't seem interested unless someone gets hurt either as a rider or as a pedestrian. They forced the sellers to change their adverts to point out the necessity of registering these machines as mopeds,but over time the adverts have deleted that info.
The Pedelecs forum is divided between those who are anti these illegal machines and those who don't care. We did at one time look at the number of motoring offences you are committing to riding these machines on the road unless you register them as mopeds,it would be possible to have a maximum penalty of 2 years in jail but that would probably only be the sentence if you hit someone
But the offences include..
Unregistered motor vehicle
Untaxed motor vehicle
Uninsured motor vehicle
Riding a motorbike without helmet
Failure to display number plate
L plates.
I am sure there are more?
But because it looks like a bicycle there is a body of opinion that none of this matters. What surprises me is that there are now so many e-bikes out there which are EN15194 legal and probably have the equal performance of the illegal bikes why does anyone take the risk?
Now wait for the verbal Exocets!
KudosDave
 
  • Like
Reactions: trex

trex

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 15, 2011
7,703
2,671
..
We're looking at the uk market and how it's going to progress over the next couple of years. People are clearly happy to buy these illegal bikes, so I was asking about the thought process, because we are genuinely interested.

Should we be selling them??

Col
Your range of bikes is about as good as any distributor is going to get - why bother with the dodgy illegal ones?
 

petitfilou

Finding my (electric) wheels
Nov 6, 2013
18
2
Stafford
As a purchaser AND returner of the BS10 due to its illegality for road use together with its almost insurability I would suggest that you reconsider your purchase .I settled for a compliant Kalkoff .The IMPULSE Harmony Nu Vinci.I am a cyclist not a Dealer and talk from personal experience
 
  • Like
Reactions: tillson

SRS

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 30, 2012
847
347
South Coast
Hi SRS

Ok, ill word my post slightly differently.

We're looking at the uk market and how it's going to progress over the next couple of years. People are clearly happy to buy these illegal bikes, so I was asking about the thought process, because we are genuinely interested.

Should we be selling them??

Hope that's a little more positive.

Col
Some are happy to buy illegal bike/s. Some are happy smoking dope.

Any law that makes no sense to a great many will be flouted. If I had the choice of a restricted or unrestricted bike, I'd choose the unrestricted.

As a note, I did own a KTM and fitted a dongle from day one. It then became a usable machine for my purposes. Had you a 350w version, I would have bought it over the legal version.

After all, the law is an ass. KTM can legally sell an illegal version to the UK public, but the public cannot use it legally.
I cannot take the people that make these rules seriously.
 
  • Like
Reactions: flapajack

Wicky

Esteemed Pedelecer
Feb 12, 2014
2,823
4,011
Colchester, Essex
www.jhepburn.co.uk
I don't envy you dealers having to be seen to abide by the letter of the law and effectively being hamstrung in the process, when the effectiveness and implementation of the law is quite fuzzy.

It seems old gits like me are being protected from 15+mph due to the fear of youths getting their dabblers on FS1E type performance. Funnily enough I know a 18 year old lad on a VTR1000F firestorm same as mine (one on flea bay £2,2000 with less than 5k mile - effectively showroom and cheaper than a lot of e-bikes) supposedly restricted to 33bhp (stock 100bhp) which still allows him to still go hairing around at 115mph [150mph unrestricted]).

I'm still pondering what to get and I wouldn't say no to something that was capable of 20mph where appropriate. i.e BS10 but would like to pop along for a test ride of Kudos and a few others in SW London. As my VTR has taught me its not the outright fastest but the real world useable torque that makes is so popular with a lot of riders of a certain bent who have seen it done and got the t-shirt.
 
  • Like
Reactions: rippedupno1

SRS

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 30, 2012
847
347
South Coast
Your range of bikes is about as good as any distributor is going to get - why bother with the dodgy illegal ones?
I think people choose illegal bikes so that they can arrive at work before it is time to go home!
 

Kudoscycles

Official Trade Member
Apr 15, 2011
5,566
5,048
www.kudoscycles.com
I think people choose illegal bikes so that they can arrive at work before it is time to go home!
Rubbish,do you write articles for the Sun?Don'tlet the truth get in the way of a good story.the legal KTM e-race Panasonic will easily match the performance of the illegal BS10.
Although the OP assures us that his posting is impartial,I always get concerned when a subjective posting gets turned into a one make advert.
I have just come back from Italy and no e-bike can be sold in that country unless it has an EN 15194 certificate. No certificate....big fines and in the crusher it goes!!!!!
Dave
 
  • Like
Reactions: tillson and oldtom

Kudoscycles

Official Trade Member
Apr 15, 2011
5,566
5,048
www.kudoscycles.com
Some are happy to buy illegal bike/s. Some are happy smoking dope.

Any law that makes no sense to a great many will be flouted. If I had the choice of a restricted or unrestricted bike, I'd choose the unrestricted.

As a note, I did own a KTM and fitted a dongle from day one. It then became a usable machine for my purposes. Had you a 350w version, I would have bought it over the legal version.

After all, the law is an ass. KTM can legally sell an illegal version to the UK public, but the public cannot use it legally.
I cannot take the people that make these rules seriously.
No the law is not an ass....these bikes can be ridden by 14 year old teenagers,there has to be a limit and whilst we(supposedly mature sensible adults) would ride the bikes in an intelligent manner. The teenager armed with a 30 mph,1000 watt e-bike could be at best a nuisance and worst dangerous riding such bikes down cycle tracks.
I personally find the 15.5 mph cutoff annoying but that is the limit chosen by the EU,but the 250 watt limit I think is ok...any more and you might as well buy a proper motorbike.
It may be of interest that I am considering importing 800 watt x 30 ah capacity small motorbikes but reading about the Lexmoto ZSX 125 that was featured in the Sunday Times for £1500 ,I have to ask what would represent the best value.
Dave
 

SRS

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 30, 2012
847
347
South Coast
No the law is not an ass....these bikes can be ridden by 14 year old teenagers,there has to be a limit and whilst we(supposedly mature sensible adults) would ride the bikes in an intelligent manner. The teenager armed with a 30 mph,1000 watt e-bike could be at best a nuisance and worst dangerous riding such bikes down cycle tracks.
I personally find the 15.5 mph cutoff annoying but that is the limit chosen by the EU,but the 250 watt limit I think is ok...any more and you might as well buy a proper motorbike.
It may be of interest that I am considering importing 800 watt x 30 ah capacity small motorbikes but reading about the Lexmoto ZSX 125 that was featured in the Sunday Times for £1500 ,I have to ask what would represent the best value.
Dave
Dave, the law is an ass. How else do you explain that is is legal to sell a product that is illegal to use? Surely it should be illegal to sell?

Kids on 1000w machines is not what we are talking about. I think 350w was mentioned.

250w is fine by me, it is the 15mph limit that is both irritating and dangerous. No other vehicle on the planet is designed to cut its power whilst the user is accelerating. Run out of natural power, yes but not switch off completely.
 

Kudoscycles

Official Trade Member
Apr 15, 2011
5,566
5,048
www.kudoscycles.com
Hi SRS

Ok, ill word my post slightly differently.

We're looking at the uk market and how it's going to progress over the next couple of years. People are clearly happy to buy these illegal bikes, so I was asking about the thought process, because we are genuinely interested.

Should we be selling them??

Hope that's a little more positive.

Col
Colin,stick with legal bikes..we have just sold a KTM Macina Sport,the purchaser may have bought an illegal from a nearby rival but he didn't like the evasive way his questions were answered, and any way the Sport was the better bike.
The only problem with KTM bikes is not selling them,at around £2k they are the most exciting bikes around...the problem is getting stock, I understand that they are outselling supply in Germany.
KudosDave