Battery Info for PowaCycle Windsor

[CameraDealer]

The battery on my wife's PowaCycle Windsor has just given up after almost seven years! Thanks to some very good advice in another section of this forum I've ordered a new Woosh Santana CD.

When we return to the UK (we're on holiday in France) I'm going to put the Windsor on Gumtree. I'd rather get fifty quid for it than scrap it. Apart from the battery it's fine.

My thoughts are that if someone buys it for between £50 and £75 and then has to buy a new battery and charger at £370, they'll still be saving a lot of money on a new one at around £700. It needs a new charger apparently because the latest battery is li-pol as opposed to li-ion.

However, the other alternative is to source a battery from another supplier at a much lower price and sell it as a complete unit with a brand new battery. Are there any such places? China for example?

The other alternative is cell replacement. Is it possible to have the li-ion cells replaced? This means no new charger, so an immediate saving of nearly £70. Does anyone know of a company that can do this?

Thanks.

 

[trex]

woosh do recelling if you bring your battery to their shop in Southend.

 

[CameraDealer]

woosh do recelling if you bring your battery to their shop in Southend.

Now that is interesting. As I've just bought a bike from them they may be willing to help. However, Southend is a bit far to go from oop north!

Do you know how easy it is to remove the existing cells so that I can just post an empty case? I can post the complete battery if necessary. I'm a retailer with an Internet/mail order side and FedEx collect every day. But it will be heavy and expensive to ship.

Either way I'll contact Woosh tomorrow.

Thanks for the very swift response.

 

[trex]

you unplug the balance wires from the BMS first, then locate the two wires that connect the pack to the BMS. Cut them. The pack is usually glued to the case but it's quite easy to pull it out.

 

[flecc]

The old type battery on the Windsor is NiMh, not li-ion, so the recelling has to be with NiMh cells, enabling you to use your existing charger. If it were li-ion you wouldn't need a new charger.

The NiMh battery does not have a BMS, just 20 NiMh 1.2 volt 8.5 Ah D cells. Recelling can be with any other NiMh capacity, 9 and 10 Ah cells commonly available but the quality often not high these days.

If intending to use Woosh, check they can recell NiMh first.

 

[CameraDealer]

The old type battery on the Windsor is NiMh, not li-ion, so the recelling has to be with NiMh cells, enabling you to use your existing charger. If it were li-ion you wouldn't need a new charger.

The NiMh battery does not have a BMS, just 20 NiMh 1.2 volt 8.5 Ah D cells. Recelling can be with any other NiMh capacity, 9 and 10 Ah cells commonly available but the quality often not high these days.

If intending to use Woosh, check they can recell NiMh first.

You're right of course. It's me getting all my lithiums confused. I've emailed Woosh to see if they can help and pasted in your advice.

 

[flecc]

The page below on my website shows the Powacycle NiMh battery pack being installed into a Lafree battery casing as a lower cost replacement. The whole Powacycle NiMh battery at that time was just £99, a replacement Lafree battery £250.

Recelling with a Powacycle pack
.

 

[trex]

flecc, can you confirm the Windsor battery is 24V 8.5AH?
then it is near enough to the larger of the two batteries in the picture below:
http://www.wooshbikes.co.uk/?batteries

 

[flecc]

Yes Trex, it was 24 volt 8.5Ah, though claimed to be 9Ah. The cells formation shape is different from your illustration though, being three rows side by side in a 7-6-7 close spaced formation, rather than the equivalent of a 2 x 10 NiMh shape.

Converting to 36 volts would need a new controller, but the controller space on the Windsor is very small, presenting problems finding something to fit in there.

 

[CameraDealer]

It appears I was wrong. I decided to get it out and have a look! My battery is actually a lithium polymer. I think I got one of the first ones after they switched from li-mh.

Apologies. Because I was told I'd need a new charger I just assumed that it was because of a change from li-ion to li-pol. And as it's died it was hidden away in the depths of my motorhome's rear garage.

My battery is 24v 10.5 amps and the latest one is 26v 10.5 amps.Perhaps that's why I'll need a new charger? Or perhaps my dealer is wrong and thinks that I do have a ni-mh version?

 

[flecc]

That is a lithium battery, calling it 24 volt was often done to conform to the convention at the time of 24 or 36 volts. In fact these Powacycle lithium ones are always 25.9 volts (so 26) nominal, or for some other lithium powered bikes, 37 volts.

You don't need a new charger, just a new battery.

 

[CameraDealer]

That is a lithium battery, calling it 24 volt was often done to conform to the convention at the time of 24 or 36 volts. In fact these Powacycle lithium ones are always 25.9 volts (so 26) nominal, or for some other lithium powered bikes, 37 volts.

You don't need a new charger, just a new battery.

Thanks, that's good news and should make it easier to sell it. I've been referring to li-mh when of course I mean ni-mh.

I blame the weather. It's so hot here in the Dordogne that it's too much at times. Sorry, couldn't resist!

 

[flecc]

No problem, here in the South East it's a glorious day. I've just come back from a walk and am still sweating from the heat. I think it's pretty much Europe wide at the moment.

 

[peerjay56]

No problem, here in the South East it's a glorious day. I've just come back from a walk and am still sweating from the heat. I think it's pretty much Europe wide at the moment.

Harrumph From a mild but very damp NW!

 

[flecc]

Harrumph From a mild but very damp NW!

Yes, I saw that. Some friends were heading for the Lake District this morning for a few days stay, hence my interest. It should get better for you from now, Wednesday nicer and Thursday should be a nice sunny and warm day there. Hope it holds for a while then.

 

[CameraDealer]

Something else has just occurred to me. We have a motorhome and for the last two weeks I was charging the PowaCycle battery using my inverter. We don't always use sites but when we do if electric hook up is extra we don't bother with it. I have a large solar panel and two leisure batteries.

A friend gave me an inverter which he no longer needed. If memory serves it's only 150 watts and as it's now fitted into a cupboard I can't read any spec. It plugs into a nearby 12v socket and normally all I charge is a camera battery, electric razor, electric toothbrush and a laptop. It saves me buying 12v leads for these and other things.

On this trip I tried using the inverter to charge the bike battery. It seemed to work and the charging light eventually changed from red to green. The weather was good so presumably the solar panel was keeping up the input sufficiently to stop the leisure batteries discharging too much. I'm now wondering if the inverter isn't up to it and this has contributed to the battery dying.

The charger details are: Input 100-240v 1.0 and its output is 29.4v 2 amps.

The battery is 24v 10.5 amps.

As some may remember I've ordered a Woosh Santana CDL. The battery is 36v 15 AH. What inverter will I need to charge that? Is it practicable or should I resign myself to using sites more often, where I'll have mains power?

Thanks

 

[trex]

the mains charger for the bike's battery uses 90W-120W. Don't worry if your inverter only goes up to 150W. If it pulls too much, the AC voltage on the inverter drops, causing the charger to use less power.
I think you can use the same inverter.
I've got this £10 one that I use on holiday about once a year:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/320895334857

 

[CameraDealer]

the mains charger for the bike's battery uses 90W-120W. Don't worry if your inverter only goes up to 150W. If it pulls too much, the AC voltage on the inverter drops, causing the charger to use less power.
I think you can use the same inverter.
I've got this £10 one that I use on holiday about once a year:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/320895334857

That's great news. Your inverter is almost identical to mine. It's nice to know that I'll be able to charge the Woosh battery in the same way. I've done it in the past but only when driving. I was really pleased when the batteries charged when on site using just the solar panel.

I've no doubt that charging the bike battery depletes the leisure batteries somewhat but the solar panel soon tops them up again.

Thanks again for a swift response.

 

[Convert-e-Bike]

It appears I was wrong. I decided to get it out and have a look! My battery is actually a lithium polymer. I think I got one of the first ones after they switched from li-mh.

Apologies. Because I was told I'd need a new charger I just assumed that it was because of a change from li-ion to li-pol. And as it's died it was hidden away in the depths of my motorhome's rear garage.

My battery is 24v 10.5 amps and the latest one is 26v 10.5 amps.Perhaps that's why I'll need a new charger? Or perhaps my dealer is wrong and thinks that I do have a ni-mh version?

View attachment 8807

Apologies for resurrecting this thread, but I have taken in a Powacycle with this same battery for repair. I just need the battery re-celling. I have had a quote of £250 but the customer only paid £150 for the bike and cannot make his mind up what to do. Can anyone help here please?

 

[Gliggsy]

Can't see that you have many alternatives here, I re-celled one last year from some cells purchased from ebay, used ones, if I'd used new cells and costed my time plus copper strip, and bms's then it would be getting close to £250, I had a quote from Jimmy at the time and seem to think it was about the same price although he was going to give me more capacity than stock lipo. I think it's only a 180 watt motor and a 24 volt system so not the most powerful although it's quite a nice bike, it's my reserve that I keep at the holiday home, its good for around twenty miles range. I don't think you'd be able to fit any other than a rear rack battery if you don't keep it stock, I suppose its his call £400 for a bike with new battery or sell it cheap and lose some money